Thread
RIP LC 575
http://www.silvernetworks.net/DSCF0009.jpg
The screen wasn't even plugged in. (something that looks like a molex power plug going from the CRT to the power board was unplugged). It didn't power on at all so I plugged it in and got the screen to come on but all distorted. The fan had fallen out of the plastic and maybe onto the CRT or something which may have knocked around some convergence settings?
Does anyone think it's repairable or should I strip it down?
The screen wasn't even plugged in. (something that looks like a molex power plug going from the CRT to the power board was unplugged). It didn't power on at all so I plugged it in and got the screen to come on but all distorted. The fan had fallen out of the plastic and maybe onto the CRT or something which may have knocked around some convergence settings?
Does anyone think it's repairable or should I strip it down?
Woah... Psychadelic, man.
Well, if its the choice between opening it up and playing with the CRT settings, and throwing it out, definitely play with the CRT settings.
Well, if its the choice between opening it up and playing with the CRT settings, and throwing it out, definitely play with the CRT settings.
If you can't get it going again. Someone with a Colour Classic might want to use the motherboard to do a Mystic upgrade!
Of course. Those are always popular - any loose LC 575 boards are popular. The problem is I think sometimes good LC 575s get cannibalized for their motherboard. I would never do that - but we'll see if I can get the CRT repaired, if not, then I'll take off any parts I can and recycle the CRT.
There are no good 575s. In fact the whole 5xx series was some kind of horrible mutant Mac-enstein design that had neither grace nor beauty. They didn't get it right until the 5000 series.
I say those motherboards are much better off in a svelte Color Classic which was jealously denied the proper horsepower from the beginning. This world was just to cruel for one as beautiful as you ...
Are you kidding me?
Methinks he has a Colour Classic in need of a 575 motherboard upgrade. Who knows, maybe there's a PM winging its way to you right now...
What he said.
oh i dont kno, i had an performa 550 that i absolutely loved. that machine was my main machine for about a year. even had it running 8.1!
The 575 had the best monitor of the entire 5xx series. The more common 580 was basically the same but with a cheaper screen to keep the price down.
That is likely true, but it was the same Sony Trinitron used in the Color Classic. Thanks for reminding me about the 580, that truly was the ugly duckling of an already deformed product line. In fact the same cheap monitor in the 5000 series destroyed any aesthetic beauty of that machine which was designed to use the Trinitron "flat" screen. Damn you Apple!
In deference to gobabushka, there was nothing wrong with the innards of the 500 series (which is why I want to transplant them into a Colour Classic). But that design ... oy, what a mess. It's like a CC on steroids and, like some kind of obsessed bodybuilder, its legs are too small for the swelled upper body and it has this huge unwieldy chunky case that just doesn't fit anywhere. The Mac TV interestingly enough was the only one I would tolerate as that black case had a way of mitigating the rushed design flaws.
what apple intended when they designed the 500 series is to take the color classic and add to it a bigger screen, and beefier components. this way it would be more compatible, and possibly more useful. now if i had a CC, i would probably make it portable-esq, and put it in my compact mac bag, and show it off. but my old 550 that i had, i loved it too.
Unless I amass a significant quantity of loose 575 motherboards, I will not sell them for Mystic upgrades. I will keep them as spares in case another 575 is broken. As it stands right now I have not had to part out any 575s. I have one loose board I got in a trade for some other stuff. My friend says the LC 575 with the bad screen may be irreparable in which case, it will be stripped for ALL usable parts and the only thing thrown away is the broken parts and the chassis metal. That's how I stripped down a 5400 with a broken tube which had apparently been dropped.
Anyone who would cannibalize a 575 just to upgrade the Color Classic is just foolish. I think that's what some of these other groups around here are doing, the other ones who buy up the old Macs at the auctions. They take out those motherboard and totally waste the rest of the Mac. That is a massive waste of resources. People buying the loose 575 boards contribute to that waste.
The Color Classic, while I'm sure is nice, is not worth destroying an entire other Mac just so it can have a 68040.
Anyone who would cannibalize a 575 just to upgrade the Color Classic is just foolish. I think that's what some of these other groups around here are doing, the other ones who buy up the old Macs at the auctions. They take out those motherboard and totally waste the rest of the Mac. That is a massive waste of resources. People buying the loose 575 boards contribute to that waste.
The Color Classic, while I'm sure is nice, is not worth destroying an entire other Mac just so it can have a 68040.
I have to agree with Mike Richardson. Tearing up a Mac to save an even more useless Mac is not a bright thing to do.
I strongly disagree with the statement "There are no good 575's".
I love my P578, more than any Mac i've ever owned. Sure, it ain't quite right, but its a wonderful machine, built right, and built to last. I wouldn't trade my P578 for any other machine.
I strongly disagree with the statement "There are no good 575's".
I love my P578, more than any Mac i've ever owned. Sure, it ain't quite right, but its a wonderful machine, built right, and built to last. I wouldn't trade my P578 for any other machine.
Unless, of course, a machine has a bad case.
I once cannibalized a very nasty looking SE/30 (it was beyond bad cosmetically...someone went wild with the Mac Cracker on the edges of it) and put the logic board in a very nice looking SE (which I actually sent to my cousin). That also left me with an SE FDHD logic board that I upgraded a regular SE with. (I prefer those mostly because of the easier to remove and replace battery--even if I have an 800K drive in the machine).
I once cannibalized a very nasty looking SE/30 (it was beyond bad cosmetically...someone went wild with the Mac Cracker on the edges of it) and put the logic board in a very nice looking SE (which I actually sent to my cousin). That also left me with an SE FDHD logic board that I upgraded a regular SE with. (I prefer those mostly because of the easier to remove and replace battery--even if I have an 800K drive in the machine).
I refer you to Mike's first statement:
http://68kmla.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=40993#40993
Seriously thought, I don't think a Mac should be destroyed just for parts. There's value in every old Mac, most of which have already found their way to the landfills. BUT, case-in-point ... I actually bought an LC 575 for the express purpose of upgrading my Color Classic. So now I had a Color Classic board with no home. So I put it in the 575 case and it works just fine. No Macs were harmed in the making of this Mystic. However, as indicated in the crushed 550 thread, my 575 arrived with a dented foot and a cracked monitor bezel despite being relatively well packed.
Perhaps I can find someone who loves those old cases as much as I love my CC and will take it off my hands.
Bad cases do have a use. I once needed a slot cover for a floppy drive on an SE and I made it out of part of an Apple IIe case using a coping saw and some sandpaper.
I would throw away a cracked case but not one that's simply yellowed.
I know how you feel...I have a very yellow Classic that for some reason has a certain charm to it...she's my gimpy Mac, been through lots of repairs in the past few years, but has a perfect CRT geometry-wise. Also, the date on this Classic is August 1990, which stands out as this one was made before they were sold!
I like the 575... viewed from the front, it has a commanding appearance; feet planted squarely on the ground, chin thrust defiantly forward, gazing skyward like a heroic worker in a soviet propaganda film. From the side, it has the look of a fierce predator crouching on its powerful haunches, ready to spring on its unsuspecting prey.
Certainly a more handsome machine than the smurftastic Color Classic.
Er, all Hook models up to the 580 had 14" Trinitrons in them that easily match and surpass the quality of the Color Classic's display. The 580 had a shadow mask tube. The 580 was also based on the 630 motherboard (IDE hard drives, shared DRAM for video). However, the 580 does allow the incorporation of a TV tuner, so that gets it some points back. ;-)
Peace,
Drew
That's funny. I always thought it kind of looked like a sphinx.
Peace,
Drew
I would go with Sphinx myself. Except the Sphinx was built correctly, ie a broader base than head. If you don't pick up a 5xx exactly right, it will tip forward and crack its commanding head wide open. From the back it sort of looks like a mausoleum crypt vault. Structurally, there is a reason it is more likely to be damaged during shipping ... it is a poorly engineered and an unwieldy design. I would be interested to know the statistics of the original damaged inventory during shipping, which in those days I believe was mostly handled by Apple which I'm sure exercised significantly more care than UPS.
Anyone who has Kunkle's Apple Design book can see pictures of the 5xx series prototypes, all of which blow the socks off what they ended up with. One of these days I'll get around to posting them. But it's clear, whatever you think about the CC, the Hook design was inspired by the CC and drew upon its unique features. It owes to the CC all of the good and none of the bad.
The biggest problem with the 5xx is that once those Macs get to that size, I would much rather go with a separate monitor and CPU which were easier to move around, ship and configure. The 5000 series improved the AIO design to the point that it all fit in the equivalent cabinet size to a monitor. The Power Mac G3 AIO tried to bee too much and ended up being almost as unwieldy as the 5xx. What barely saves it is good design and construction, despite the fact it looks like a bug molar. The iMac of course fixed all of that.
Just out of curiosity, If I was absolutely in love with the 5xx case design and wouldn't want any other computer sitting on my desk, would the contributors to this article be as outraged if I wanted to strip the logicboard out of a 5500 to upgrade my 580? Or is that just as taboo?
It's also worth noting that a 475 with the matching monitor is considerably more compact than the 575... and prettier.
Personally, I don't hold stock in the idea that a computer deserves any more respect than any other tool. Put a rock through it for all I care. (Or don't and donate it to charity - it would be a shame to destroy a tool just because you can when another person might get some use from it.)
That said, you would have trouble putting a 5500 board in a 5x0 for two reasons: Machines up to the 575 (inclusive) had a shorter logic board so it won't fit physically. The 5500 requires 3.3V which isn't supplied by the 5x0 power supply (to the best of my knowledge). So even if you wanted to put a 5500 board in a 580 where it might physically fit, it wouldn't run.
However, you could add a 3.3V regulator to a 580 and probably be fine. And while you are at it, why not swap in the Trinitron CRT from an abandoned LC 520? Then it would be a great machine! ;-)
Peace,
Drew
Assuming that were possible, it would still be a terrible waste of a computer just to get the motherboard out of it.
At what point do they stop being a tool and become something more?
Pretty much the only exception to that rule for me is when the computer is an observed collectable: The price for resale exceeds the value of the computer based on it's capabilities. But at that point the computer stops being a tool and becomes a collector's item. My TAM is a case in point. The 5500/250 has equal capabilities, and paying more than $50 for one is certifiable insanity (IMO), but I happily paid several hundred for my TAM. I won't cannibalize the TAM because it is not a tool. It is a collector's item that I invested in.
The Color Classic is similarly collectable but holds significantly less value than the TAM. As it is less valuable, I had no problem gutting and carving mine to convert it to a Takky (though the conversion is as yet incomplete). The 5x0 series and 5xxx series have no collector's value and thus no intrinsic worth other than what use I can get out of them as a tool. That doesn't stop me from buying one and preserving it in my collection, but I feel no guilt about destroying a second, third, or thirtieth for any reason provided that the destruction results in some increase in overall net worth or even some temporary entertainment (though, actually, destroying one for fun might make me feel guilty because I have deprived someone else of a useful tool just for entertainment's sake).
Peace,
Drew
The Color Classic is similarly collectable but holds significantly less value than the TAM. As it is less valuable, I had no problem gutting and carving mine to convert it to a Takky (though the conversion is as yet incomplete). The 5x0 series and 5xxx series have no collector's value and thus no intrinsic worth other than what use I can get out of them as a tool. That doesn't stop me from buying one and preserving it in my collection, but I feel no guilt about destroying a second, third, or thirtieth for any reason provided that the destruction results in some increase in overall net worth or even some temporary entertainment (though, actually, destroying one for fun might make me feel guilty because I have deprived someone else of a useful tool just for entertainment's sake).
Peace,
Drew
While particular computers may not be collectable now, what's to say that the computer won't be collectable in the future?
Most computers of a particular model wind up getting crushed or recycled or thrown away, leaving the remaining models more scarce. Look at the Apple I. They made something like a few hundred? Or perhaps thousand. But now there exists only a handful of such computers.
Most LC 5xx will be crushed. In 10 years I bet they're collectable.
There are plenty of things that are collectable and still almost worthless.
Plenty of 5xx units will be around for collectors in the future I think.
Plenty of 5xx units will be around for collectors in the future I think.
Well, you are welcome to hold onto them until the. For your sake, I hope they don't turn into $10 pieces of junk that you offload at a garage sale because your family is screaming at you that they want a place to park the car.
This is bad logic. Commodity tools are virtually never collectible unless they are fairly antique. The reason people throw them away is because they are without value from the start. The same is NOT true of machines like the TAM and Apple I which were originally acknowledged to be in short supply or had other defining characteristics that gave them value beyond their mere utility. The Apple I was hardly a capable machine, and even though it was rare, it didn't have value because of the rareness. It had value because of it's novelty. The same is true of the Mac TV and the TAM. The same is true of most prototypes and pre-production Macs. Can you say this about the LC 575?
You have to draw the line somewhere lest you become a pack rat. The mentality you describe just results in needless hoarding. Why stop with the LC 580? Why not also include that vintage Sony WEGA Trinitron TV you've got in your living room? In thirty years time, they'll be plenty rare, too! And why stop even there?! What about that cordless phone you've got? No doubt that in one hundred years, you'll be the only person who has one! My, won't that be a hit on Antiques Roadshow!
Your point neglects the reality that most machines, no matter how much you wish it weren't true, will just never be collectibles. And besides, even if one simply defines something's value to a collector by it's rarity, then diminishing the supply by destroying surplus equipment, one automatically increases the value of the remainder of the supply. In that case, you should applaud the needless destruction of Macs in other people's collections. But that is a poor way to define a collector's item's value.
Peace,
Drew