Do all IIsi adapters work with SE/30

Yes they do, but they don't physically fit, because the chassis is in the way of the card slot (or slots in this case), which sticks out at right angles from the IIsi card. The SE/30 version was just the same card with a connector that pointed vertically up, not out at 90-degrees.

Forget the case. If I stick this card in an SE/30 will nubus cards work with it?

probably - but what card are you thinking of using that would be of use in a se/30?

Maybe small 1 MB Nubus graphics card with Turbo040

it would be a big hackintosh once you were done customising - killing any point of the cool form factor se/30. Worth a shot just for curiosity's sake however I agree.

We never did establish if the turbo 601 works in a se/30 did we? Probably a more worthwhile project IMO.

The IIsi adapter will work. I know this for a fact because I once owned one and tested it in my SE/30 logic board, with the logic board hanging outside the case. I tested with a Turbo 040 accelerator and a MacCon Ethernet card. The IIsi adapter works perfectly in any SE/30. But I was unwilling to cut the metal frame of my SE/30 chassis, so I sold the IIsi adapter for $33 to someone who was willing to cut on his chassis. I ended up buying a Stratos TS Adapter from Manabu Sakai of Artmix Japan (for $175). I now have the TS Adapter (and Turbo 040 40MHz card, with latest edition ROM) in storage and use a 50MHz DiiMO accelerator in my SE/30 full time.

In regards to the IIsi adapter, you also need to consider that even if you make it fit your SE/30, the fact remains that any card you attach will not fit without first removing the floppy and hard disk. The card is very short, and any accelerators you add would be parallel to the motherboard. This is the advantage of the TS Adapter. The TS Adapter is taller and will allow you to keep a floppy and hard drive in their normal mounting locations. The DiiMO accelerator also solves many problems too with its pass-thru connector on top. And even though the DiiMO is a bit slower than even a Turbo 040 25MHz, I have found it more compatible than any DayStar 040 card (with or without 040 cache disabled).

So really, it's a lot of work to get the IIsi adapter to function the way you want it in an SE/30. That's why I ultimately broke down and bought that TS Adapter, and why I later bought the DiiMO. You can see my DiiMO photos here. I mention where they are sold in the comments under the main photo.

With any adapter meant for a IIsi, make sure there's no FPU chip installed in it. The IIsi didn't come with an FPU, and the SE/30 did. So if you put a IIsi card that has an FPU on board into an SE/30, the SE/30 won't boot.

Usually these FPUs are just socketed, so you can remove them and then use the card in an SE/30 with no problem.

The card you have posted pics of may not have an FPU, so this issue may be moot in that case.

Best,

Matt

With any adapter meant for a IIsi, make sure there's no FPU chip installed in it. The IIsi didn't come with an FPU, and the SE/30 did. So if you put a IIsi card that has an FPU on board into an SE/30, the SE/30 won't boot.
Usually these FPUs are just socketed, so you can remove them and then use the card in an SE/30 with no problem.

The card you have posted pics of may not have an FPU, so this issue may be moot in that case.

Best,

Matt

Click to expand...

I don't believe it does have a FPU. It was designed for using with the Turbo 040 which would bypass it anyway...

It should work in the SE/30, but you'll have to perform some surgery to get it to fit in there. There's details on Gamba's site here:

http://home.earthlink.net/~gamba2/se30_pds_multiple.html

hang on - this is a nubus adapter - not a powercache adapter. Unless the extra slot has "for powercache only" on it (which converts it into a iici pds slot), assume it to be just a passthrough of the iisi's pds.

Sorry, I didn't look closely at the photos. I now see that this is for NuBus, not PDS. And the FPU is soldered in, not socketed like the PDS version.

My comments above stand so long as you get a PDS version of the card. My comments above do not apply to this NuBus board. Sorry for the confusion.

Actually this card goes into IIsi PDS slot because IIsi do not have a NuBus slot. There is one another type of card that can be found on ebay very easily that converts the PDS slot to NuBus slot only w/o any pass thru.

As I said this card goes into PDS slot. The lower slot in the picture which is shorter than the upper slot is NuBus and the upper slot is PDS and it accepts Powercache or Turbo 040 but I am not sure about Turbo 601. I have one IIsi Turbo 601 adapter however it has only one slot no PDS pass thru. I ordered TwinSpark adapter as well.

Collecting all the parts will take some time. My ultimate goal is to use Turbo 601 in SE/30 with IIsi ROM. I will report my findings in my web page.

Don't hold your breaths though. }

Be that as it may, my IIsi PDS adapter (the one which I sold) had a socket for the FPU. But the card shown in the photos above show a soldered FPU. Whether this card will work in an SE/30 or no, I cannot say. I can only state my experience with the FPU socket version of the card (which had no FPU socketed in my tests).

My confusion was whether the adaptor's additional slot was just passing through the PDS slot or converting it into a slot that can handle the powercache (a IICI PDS slot)

But now i read the back of the box in the third picture I understand. It gives you a nubus slot and a powercache slot.

Not sure that chip is a FPU actually (can't tell by pics - it's an AMD chip though). Even if it was, it wouldn't make sense that it would preclude an accelerator working when the back of the box specifically states it is to be used with one.

While it's indeed interesting, having a slot wasted with nubus does prevent you from doing some of the nice configurations you see at gamba's page however

Power will be your main issue I think - esp with the 601. Maybe some of the nubus cards that don't require a backplate could be an option? Something like the radius photengine for instance (not very useful on a 2 bit machine though)?

... With any adapter meant for a IIsi, make sure there's no FPU chip installed in it. The IIsi didn't come with an FPU, and the SE/30 did. So if you put a IIsi card that has an FPU on board into an SE/30, the SE/30 won't boot.

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I had an early Christmas recently when I got hold of the DayStar manuals (both) for Mac Classic and SE and for SE/30, LC, LC II, II, IIx, IIcx, IIsi, IIvx, IIvi and Performa 400, 600 (DayStar's title, not mine), because I hoped to settle for once and all that fundamental question about the universe: should the 68882 be removed from the PowerCache when that is used in an SE/30?

Sadly, not so. The manual deals only with the 030 PDS slot-based adapter for the SE/30, and does not mention the adapter that plugs into the 68030's socket. To DayStar the FPU question appears to have been a matter of profound unconcern, because it rates not a mention in 210pp (total) of instruction, and, let's face it, a 68882 is not lightly removed from an SE/30, even if the 68030 is sometimes socketted. While it is conceivable that DayStar's 030 PDS adapter for the SE/30 tacitly disables the 68882 on a PowerCache card, the adapter could equally well have been engineered to disable the logic-board FPU. In sum, though, the need to do so doesn't rate a mention. I can't dispute from experience the long-held opinion that providing two FPUs is Not Done, but there is no corroboration in the manuals.

The manual for the two 68000 Macs is at pains to stress that only the P33 and P34 PowerCache cards (not the card without a type number) will work in the SE and Classic, and lets slip that those cards can also be used in the Colour Classic (with the LC PDS adapter). With all these revelations it might be expected that any special requirements for the SE/30 would have been mentioned, but there is nary a whisper. But is the universe still safe?

de

An afterthought ... disabling the logicboard-FPU of the SE/30 (by the 030 PDS adapter) would make sufficient sense when it is considered that the 50MHz PowerCache card comes with a 50MHz 68882, as all eight of my cards did.

de

It is reasonable to expect that software for an accelerator would disable the 68882 on the logic board. That particular 68882 is located just where the accelerator software could expect to find it. 68882s on ethernet cards and adapter boards are trickier to find, so make it easier for the software by pulling the chip. I hate saying it, but for a soldered on chip, you might need to cut it out. But if it is on the logic board, leave it alone.

So the question remains: does anyone have experience using a IIci adapter to get NuBus cards to work in an SE/30? Or is it simply impossible to get any kind of NuBus card to work in an SE/30 regardless of adapter?

So the question remains: does anyone have experience using a IIci adapter to get NuBus cards to work in an SE/30? Or is it simply impossible to get any kind of NuBus card to work in an SE/30 regardless of adapter?

Click to expand...

some very interesting posts,concerning these adapters..

In any event, seems that many of us, are pushing the SE/30

far past it's operational mode...doing stuff that apple's engineers

did not consider...The SE/30, is such a robust compact mac,

no wonder close to 20 yrs after it's release, they are still pretty

well sought after, able to do many tasks...

think about it..it was a basically a IIx, inna compact case..

when apple was fishing for a name for it...SE-X ?

Macintosh SEX ?

Now that would have been a hoot...

While I am aware Apple engineers did not design the SE/30 for NuBus cards, I still would appreciate hearing from those of you out there who might have the IIci adapter mentioned in this thread and given it a try.

That's the fun in Classic Macing and in participating in this forum. It's amazing what our old Macs are capable of!

JDW: Is it pure mischance that you have twice mentioned the 'IIci' adapter in the SE/30? As far as I know the IIsi PDS-to-whatever adapter and the IIci cache adapter (in fact, a IIci PDS-to-whatever adapter) are not electrically the same. This seems to be supported by the Universal PowerCache 030 accelerator's ability to plug straight into a IIci's PDS slot, but its need to have an interposed adapter in just about every other case. The SE/30 needs a IIsi PDS to IIci PDS adapter just as is used in the IIsi. The IIcx needs an 030 socket to IIci PDS adapter, and so on, and on.

Or did you have some special wrinkle of architecture to explore?

de

equill, I spotted a post on another Mac forum site where they were discussing this thread 68kMLA in light in the context of getting NuBus cards to work in SE/30 Macs. They had access to not only a IIci but also an SE/30, as well as adapters and NuBus cards. I doubt that it will fit or even work, but I thought I would post here to see if anyone had been able to debunk the theory that it would even work.

That is what prompted me to post in this thread again.

Ahh. You were being but the messenger. Without seeing the thread that you mention, I am tempted to conclude that the notion was raised there without awareness of the 'bus' part of NuBus, in an innocent spirit of wish-fulfilment.

The altogether-human reduction of 'NuBus-compatible card' to 'NuBus card'—metonymy in full flower—led the questioner to neglect the requirement that the host computer should have NuBus-savvy and a NuBus, which implies not only a controller on its MLB but also 32-bit cleanth.

Certainly the SE/30 is credited with a pseudo-NuBus slot ($0E) to deal with its video, and another ($09) if it has a MacCon30si ethernet card, but there is only a physical PDS slot that can be persuaded to simulate a NuBus slot. Given a thorough and total re-invention of an SE/30's MLB (and ROM), a NuBus-compatible card can be hypothesized to work in an SE/30. It should surely be quicker and easier, however, to start with a IIsi.

de

Or a IIsi ROM?

Also, may I say, what an awesome card, and I want one.

Bunsen, I currently have a IIsi ROM running in the SE/30 shown here. (But you may already know that if you are in fact "Dr Bunsen.") I also have a IIfx ROM that works the same, but it shows horizontal lines at startup for a few seconds. The IIsi ROM works as seamless as the stock ROM.

I can confirm that NuBus cards *can* work in the SE/30, at least in principle. The "ExpanSE/30" expansion case interfaced via a PDS card and had 2 or 4 NuBus slots.

I don't have one, but I want one!

I'm fairly certain that the IIsi NuBus adaptor card will allow use of a NuBus card in the SE/30 motherboard, but I'll have to try it out sometime to make sure.

I'll have to try it out sometime to make sure.

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In the next 72 hours, perhaps? :b&w:

Inquiring minds want to know!

In the next 72 hours, perhaps? :b&w:

Click to expand...

Given my track record for Mac stuff lately, we'll be lucky to see 72 days 8-o