Thread
The latest mac build. A Mac Plus/Core 2/Color.
It took several weeks to source all the parts, but I think I've done it.
The hardest part was locating the 10" color crt capable of displaying 1024x768 that was short enough to fit in the case, I finally found one, so the mod is underway.
Specs.
Intel Atom core 2 running at 2 ghz.
2gb ram
300 gb 7200 rpm sata HDD
Intel GMA integrated graphics
integrated iphone dock
integrated USB breakout box (this rig will be used as an effect box for guitar performances)
integrated webcam/microphone.
CD/DVD RW slot loading.
functional auto eject floppy.
Every compact mac mod I've seen (with the exception of takky CC upgrades) has been pretty sloppy. Even if the mod doesn't effect the external asthetics of the mac, the inside is rife with velcro and cut corners. I know I'll never see the inside of this box, but it will make me feel better that everything looks integrated, like it came that way from the factory.
I chose the atom processor, (mini itx form factor) because I thought the beauty of these first macs was the lack of noise they made. This setup will allow me to run fanless.
For your eyes only spyshot below.
Further updates as I make them.
The hardest part was locating the 10" color crt capable of displaying 1024x768 that was short enough to fit in the case, I finally found one, so the mod is underway.
Specs.
Intel Atom core 2 running at 2 ghz.
2gb ram
300 gb 7200 rpm sata HDD
Intel GMA integrated graphics
integrated iphone dock
integrated USB breakout box (this rig will be used as an effect box for guitar performances)
integrated webcam/microphone.
CD/DVD RW slot loading.
functional auto eject floppy.
Every compact mac mod I've seen (with the exception of takky CC upgrades) has been pretty sloppy. Even if the mod doesn't effect the external asthetics of the mac, the inside is rife with velcro and cut corners. I know I'll never see the inside of this box, but it will make me feel better that everything looks integrated, like it came that way from the factory.
I chose the atom processor, (mini itx form factor) because I thought the beauty of these first macs was the lack of noise they made. This setup will allow me to run fanless.
For your eyes only spyshot below.
Further updates as I make them.
I hate to see a Mac turned into a PC (or are you putting OS X on it?), but I must admit, I find the idea of turning it into a guitar FX box very interesting! Good luck with the mod, I'll be watching this with interest!
It'll be interesting to see how you get the flat LCD monitor to mate to the curve of the Mac Plus' case. The most elaborate mod I've seen so far involved cutting the curved glass front off the CRT so that it could be left in the case and the flat LCD placed behind it. That must be a ton of work though. I take it that you're gonna run some kinda VST host or something on it?
It'll be interesting to see how you get the flat LCD monitor to mate to the curve of the Mac Plus' case. The most elaborate mod I've seen so far involved cutting the curved glass front off the CRT so that it could be left in the case and the flat LCD placed behind it. That must be a ton of work though. I take it that you're gonna run some kinda VST host or something on it?
Here is the link to the monitor that will be serving as the donor for the CRT
http://www.vibrantepos.co.uk/products_crt_vs10s.php
(link dead - see archive copy)
It looks as if the monitor has a very similar curve profile to the existing crt. I have not trimmed from the front of the Plus, and hopefully won't have to.
-Patrick
http://www.vibrantepos.co.uk/products_crt_vs10s.php
(link dead - see archive copy)
It looks as if the monitor has a very similar curve profile to the existing crt. I have not trimmed from the front of the Plus, and hopefully won't have to.
-Patrick
Further building, the power supply arrived today, so this is what I've got so far.
First off, I wanted to utilize the Plus' original power switch, power outlet, and battery. I did this to allow the machine to look stock from the outside. (As I post further build steps it will become obvious how I will do this on the data ports at the bottom, but we'll cross that bridge when we get to it.)
Here is an angle that shows you how I've begun routing the wires running from the PS to the mainboard.
Here it is during test fitting; they fit exactly into the space provided, without a millimeter of wiggle room.
Next up will be drilling holes in the chassis to mount the motherboard permanently to. And building cages for the drives.
I'll post more as I get to it.
-Patrick
First off, I wanted to utilize the Plus' original power switch, power outlet, and battery. I did this to allow the machine to look stock from the outside. (As I post further build steps it will become obvious how I will do this on the data ports at the bottom, but we'll cross that bridge when we get to it.)
Here is an angle that shows you how I've begun routing the wires running from the PS to the mainboard.
Here it is during test fitting; they fit exactly into the space provided, without a millimeter of wiggle room.
Next up will be drilling holes in the chassis to mount the motherboard permanently to. And building cages for the drives.
I'll post more as I get to it.
-Patrick
I hope that it's not a typo. Vibrant appears to be a badged re-seller. Here's a link to the manufacturer's literature (archive copy), which TVS doesn't seem to make anymore. It sure looks like standard color CRT specs, though, with a 300mm depth. Let us know when you get the monitor. If so, the 24th Anniversary Macintosh grayscale monitor is not a bad way to go and it will definitely fit.
First up, 200mm, not 200cm. 200cm is over six feet!
TVS's SVGA 9" greyscale caught my eye, so I checked out the specs on that one. Even that is 246mm deep. Can't get to a Compact right now - does anyone want to measure one/several and post the depth?
I did measure a CC, and at 320mm it should hold the above colour CRT comfortably
Thanks, but I guess you didn't notice my location - it's under my avatar. At AU$300 (US$200) after shipping, I might as well pick up a local or Hong Kong LCD.
Still curious about what you're paying for yours.
You see how easy it is to make a typo!
The Macintosh 128K through the SE/30 are all 9.6" wide by 10.9" (276.8mm) deep. The Classic & Classic 2 are 11.2" (284.5mm) deep, due solely to the radius curve in front. The Color Classic grows to 12.6" (320mm) deep. Of course the sole reason the CC is the longest compact is because it was designed to handle the additional depth required by color monitors. Complicating matters, is the fact that the B&W compacts don't actually have the full depth in which to fit the monitor thanks to their perpendicular back (the CC's back is parallel to the front angle giving it a uniform depth), resulting in a maximum depth of about 9.2" (235mm) where the top of the CRT neck connector would hit the rear case. Now granted, the manufacturer specs on those monitors are giving details of the case exterior, the grayscale of which probably has at least 1" (25mm) of padding, so the actual CRT would easily fit within the Mac space allotted. Apply the same ratio to the colour display, even if the padding is doubled, the CRT won't fit in the Mac Plus case by at least 25mm.
Well hell....
Everyone was right, I received the monitor yesterday, and it can't fit. I suppose I'll have to go with the 8.4 Camos LCD screen. Perhaps I'll cut the front glass off of the plus' original monitor to make for a more accurate exterior. I don't really know that it is worth the trouble though.
-Bummed.
Everyone was right, I received the monitor yesterday, and it can't fit. I suppose I'll have to go with the 8.4 Camos LCD screen. Perhaps I'll cut the front glass off of the plus' original monitor to make for a more accurate exterior. I don't really know that it is worth the trouble though.
-Bummed.
I don't think it would be too bad if you had a bump-out on the back. I think a curved CRT that you can see from the front and an extra box on the back look better than an LCD and and intact back. The front is much more important than the back in my opinion.
It's possible the video board on the back of the CRT isn't very large too, so it may be a small box. I want to see a color CRT in a Mac Plus!! You may be able to cut exactly around the big Mac Plus label on the back and bump out that whole area.
It's possible the video board on the back of the CRT isn't very large too, so it may be a small box. I want to see a color CRT in a Mac Plus!! You may be able to cut exactly around the big Mac Plus label on the back and bump out that whole area.
Sorry to hear it. I was afraid of that since even a small 4" color CRT has a neck about as long as a 10" CRT for some technical reason.
Normally, I would be against mutilating a Plus in such a way, but even Apple agrees with Dennis Nedry. One of the little things that drives me crazy about the HD20 case is that it has a little bump out the back for a fan which totally ruins the profile of the unit from the side and back, but the front of the design looks great. Also, the Plus is available in ample supply, unlike the 128K & 512K. I'd prefer to see this done to a Platinum model for this reason.
I disagree about the LCD. There have ben some successful implementations of them. If one could use a smaller resolution within a frame of the native resolution, a larger LCD should fit flat against the bezel with the gaps filled in by some black masking and look pretty nice. I do think the Plus looks better aesthetically with the curved screen so using the front of a CRT in theory should look great. According to one report, using a diamond Dremel saw made the process a snap, especially since it doesn't have to look too pretty. So it is definitely worth the consideration. Here is a previous discussion with some links.
My goal would be to leave the unit as intact as possible – one of the reasons I love the 24th Anniversary model complete with its original, yet re-mapped functional ports. Cutting a hole in the back ruins that. Using an LCD alters the look, but if behind curved glass, then it should look OEM. He still has to work out how to connect the original keyboard and mouse as well.
nextse7en, this is a great project! I especially like the clean look of your custom-made innards. I thought I had to jump in that thread just to show off once more with my own Macintosh SE/X (which I recently re-branded from its original "Macminitosh"): flickr gallery.
I went the easy way with a complete Core Duo Mac mini, which I didn't bother to open, since it fits right in. But yours looks much cleaner inside! As for the screen, I chose the 8.4'' LCD way, with a soft black mask around the edges which practically fills the gaps. Now I heard some people around here cutting the original CRT's front, and I may well give that a try sooner or later.
Anyway, good luck and have a lot of fun in your project!
I went the easy way with a complete Core Duo Mac mini, which I didn't bother to open, since it fits right in. But yours looks much cleaner inside! As for the screen, I chose the 8.4'' LCD way, with a soft black mask around the edges which practically fills the gaps. Now I heard some people around here cutting the original CRT's front, and I may well give that a try sooner or later.
Anyway, good luck and have a lot of fun in your project!
And there's also already a Mac Minitosh out there, sadly… I like both names. At first I named my project after the destruc.tv one (too bad he painted it black, otherwise it's pretty cool!), which is the one which got me started. Then, after crawling the web for similar projects to get some inspiration, I sure discovered the Apptree.net project. If I recall well, I even wrote a couple of mails to that guy for advice. His pictures helped me a lot to in figuring things out, even though I ended making different choices. But I dislike what he did with the display. It doesn't feel right. And he named it the SE/X even though his is obviously a Classic case (actually a Classic II, he says).
So mine is the only known "real" SE/X!!!
I agree about the display on the SE/X, it's the flatness juxtaposed with the radius arc (the same thing happened with the LC580). And it is of course a Classic form factor – then again yours is a Plus too (like the distruc.tv one, which I actually don't care for in black), so really none of you is entitled to the "SE/X" name. If anyone does, it's this guy's Mac mini mod (archive copy). Of course his is uncharacteristically sloppy for a Japanese mod.But I dislike what he did with the display. It doesn't feel right. And he named it the SE/X even though his is obviously a Classic case (actually a Classic II, he says)...So mine is the only known "real" SE/X!!!
Of course SEx is not taken, but it still needs to be an SE and technically a 68030. Despite the clever stories related about Apple choosing the SE/30 name, technically it would have been SEcx, to correspond to the IIcx (compact '030) released at the same time, which is simply kind of messy. Also, "SE" stood for the English words "System Expansion". The "II" was a Roman numeral. In general, they mixed letters an numbers, so the SEx would have been an aberration in relation to their current system. Also Apple had a significant international presence by this time and had already begun re-branding certain models with numbers where the English words would have no meaning: the "Macintosh 512K enhanced" became the "512K/800" abroad. Later the SE would would follow suit: "Macintosh SE 1/20" instead of "FDHD" which would have no meaning in a language other than English, whereas the original SE's had descriptions on the label like "1 Mbyte RAM, Two 800K Drives". So I seriously doubt Apple ever considered "SEx" as anything other than a joke.
Hey, stop kidding!
nextse7en's (thread author) is a Plus, as the title of the thread says. But mine is a SE all the way through it's smallest screws, and you won't be able to prove me wrong! 
And since it's a SE and not a SE/30 case, as you pointed out, and obviously running OS X, I bet it still deserves its SE/X name. I'll pay some royalties to that guy!
Nuts :-/ You haven't mentioned price, but I'll bet that wasn't cheap. Well, at least you've got a perfect monitor for a CC mod ;D
A semi-random thought: at 9" and 1024x768, maybe a monochrome screen is actually a better idea, in terms of readability?
Anyone else ever have one of those old wooden cased CRT televisions with a truncated cone, like a cup, protruding from the back for the last few inches of tube? Maybe one of them would be aesthetically acceptable. I suggest making one or two different model bump-outs up out of card and sticking them to the back of the case for a few days before making any cuts. See if you can live with them
Is there any way the front bezel could be modded to give you a little extra room forwards?
I hates, hates, hates it, and want to stab it with fire. It's too .... busy, with all those steps between the case front and the screen proper, and way too obviously a hack, considering the quality of finish on the rest of the box. It would have looked far nicer to extend the angled sides inwards to meet the screen edges (Bondo, modelling clay, bog, balsa wood) instead of having that extra step at the last approach. Heck, I prefer the Japanese hacks that mount a larger LCD flush with the case front.
Sadly this doesn't work for a CC either which used the relatively flat Trintron CRT with only a horizontal curve. So the shadow mask would still need filler on the top and bottom of the screen.
The larger LCDs still do not sit flush as it only touches the corners, requiring filler on all four sides. But as you say, still better than that silly lip which alters too much of the design. Of all the designs that the flat LCD looks best with, it is the SE which is accommodates it most, Esslinger's Snow White design language being essentially flat, geometric and utilitarian.
Oops, got confused there for a minute. Yes of course yours gets to be the "SE/X". The other guy has to pay you royalties. Perhaps you should label yours simply "SE X", or "SE:X". Actually his would have turned out much better had he actually used an SE per my observation above.
Then there's this one, which Bunsen seems to thinkshould be labeled simply "SEX". Interesting that the CRT appears to have been modified to use a color Trinitron CRT. Note the bump out in the back to accommodate the extra length of the color CRT and the horizontal curve only in the face, hard to tell, but the bezel would have had to be modified over the original at Digibarn which seems to clearly show a bubble-shaped shadowmask bezel. This is similar to the extra pack they added to the Macintosh in "Pirates of Silicon Valley" to accommodate the extra video cabling.
Hey thanks, you just gave me an idea; when I have some idea I'll try and find one of those letters decal sheet to see if I could label a /X or :x on the front bezel. Could look cool!
@nextse7en: How's it going for you? Did you find a solution, or changed your mind on the type of monitor you'll be using?
I can't believe I missed this thread the first time through!
I have been wanting to do something similar and acquired my case donor, motherboard, and 8.4" color LCD last April or May, but other than acquiring parts, I haven't made any progress.
So far what I have is a pile of parts sitting on a desk that boots OS X Leopard 10.5.6. I'm using a Jetway J9F2-KHDE Mini-ITX board and a small 150W PSU. I'm using a iMate Griffin so I can reuse the original keyboard... I could reuse the original mouse too, but I'm too addicted to scroll-wheels and right-clicks to use the original mouse. I may buy a Mighty Mouse just to keep everything Apple.
On mine, I'm leaning towards mounting the motherboard low in the same place as the original, and carefully cutting out a perfect rectangle in the rear for the I/O shield. If it looks clean enough, I'm not sure there's a lot of value in preserving the original port holes.
I've been wishy-washy on the screen. I bought an 8.4" color LCD, but I kind of like the retro look of the original B&W CRT. I have had thoughts about building a custom CRT board with grayscale video amp based on a schematic I downloaded from here, and finding a way to mod the analog board to accept VGA sync. Perhaps boosting horizontal deflection voltage is enough to accomplish this? Based on what vague information I've been able to find on the Color Classic VGA mod, all they did was boost horizontal deflection voltage. If there was much more done than that, they failed to mention it. I'm not too worried about the low resolution of VGA since I'll be using a 24" LCD as a primary and the internal screen will just be a secondary.
I'm also not sure cutting the front off a CRT to use with an LCD is the best idea. My LCD has an anti-glare coating, and so does the CRT. Wouldn't doubling-up on the anti-glare result in a blurry LCD? I have that concern, and also feel bad about cutting up a perfectly good CRT. An alternate idea I had is to get a piece of clear plexiglass (Lexan), place it over the face of the original CRT, and heat it up with a heat gun. It should (in theory) soften and form to the shape of the CRT. Then use that as a lens on top of the LCD. This would result in a shiny and not entirely authentic appearance, but should still match the aesthetics I think.
Anyway, cool project, keep us updated on how you decide to proceed. It may help me make up my own mind on my own project!
I have been wanting to do something similar and acquired my case donor, motherboard, and 8.4" color LCD last April or May, but other than acquiring parts, I haven't made any progress.
So far what I have is a pile of parts sitting on a desk that boots OS X Leopard 10.5.6. I'm using a Jetway J9F2-KHDE Mini-ITX board and a small 150W PSU. I'm using a iMate Griffin so I can reuse the original keyboard... I could reuse the original mouse too, but I'm too addicted to scroll-wheels and right-clicks to use the original mouse. I may buy a Mighty Mouse just to keep everything Apple.
On mine, I'm leaning towards mounting the motherboard low in the same place as the original, and carefully cutting out a perfect rectangle in the rear for the I/O shield. If it looks clean enough, I'm not sure there's a lot of value in preserving the original port holes.
I've been wishy-washy on the screen. I bought an 8.4" color LCD, but I kind of like the retro look of the original B&W CRT. I have had thoughts about building a custom CRT board with grayscale video amp based on a schematic I downloaded from here, and finding a way to mod the analog board to accept VGA sync. Perhaps boosting horizontal deflection voltage is enough to accomplish this? Based on what vague information I've been able to find on the Color Classic VGA mod, all they did was boost horizontal deflection voltage. If there was much more done than that, they failed to mention it. I'm not too worried about the low resolution of VGA since I'll be using a 24" LCD as a primary and the internal screen will just be a secondary.
I'm also not sure cutting the front off a CRT to use with an LCD is the best idea. My LCD has an anti-glare coating, and so does the CRT. Wouldn't doubling-up on the anti-glare result in a blurry LCD? I have that concern, and also feel bad about cutting up a perfectly good CRT. An alternate idea I had is to get a piece of clear plexiglass (Lexan), place it over the face of the original CRT, and heat it up with a heat gun. It should (in theory) soften and form to the shape of the CRT. Then use that as a lens on top of the LCD. This would result in a shiny and not entirely authentic appearance, but should still match the aesthetics I think.
Anyway, cool project, keep us updated on how you decide to proceed. It may help me make up my own mind on my own project!
Here's an SE/Color CRT modified project. You will note, he had the exact same problem one faces when attempting to put a color CRT into a compact Mac case and no good solution. Obviously, the placement of the neck precludes a tasteful bump through the rear label, and depending on the CRT, a tasteful solution at all. Given that this requires a major case mod, it is not my preferred choice by any means. The LCD is the only way to go on the B&W compacts.
I disagree. I think you could build around that. If you pushed out the entire rear of the case by 3 inches, I think it would look just fine. I think the look and feel of a REAL color CRT is worth the expanded backside.
Get creative. Reverse-engineer what they were thinking when the originally designed the case and put your own Apple Magic into it. I guarantee that real Mac designers ran into problems like that all the time and built around it somehow, and made it all look OK in the end. When it comes right down to it, this is the BACK of the Mac. It should look good but I don't think authenticity is crucial. I would have a huge horrible mess in the back before I would install a weird-looking flat LCD panel in the front that I look at all the time.
Get creative. Reverse-engineer what they were thinking when the originally designed the case and put your own Apple Magic into it. I guarantee that real Mac designers ran into problems like that all the time and built around it somehow, and made it all look OK in the end. When it comes right down to it, this is the BACK of the Mac. It should look good but I don't think authenticity is crucial. I would have a huge horrible mess in the back before I would install a weird-looking flat LCD panel in the front that I look at all the time.
You are basically describing what they did to the Watchmen Mac SE (as well as the Macintosh in "Pirates of Silicon Valley"). However, what you propose is the quintessential debate for any vintage mod conversion. Whether to irrevocably destroy an increasingly rare item or preserve it in such a way it can be fully restored. Most take "the high road" and preserve the case intact. This is my preferred choice, though I am a little more lenient towards Platinum Pluses, SEs and Classics which exist in far greater numbers than the 128K, 512K, SE/30s and CLassic IIs. As for the LCD, this idea of putting it behind the CRT glass is enough for me. It's not a whole lot different than the current iMac, though the glass is not curved of course.
Not sure grayscale would help or not, considering the depth of color throughout OS X, but with a CRT, if you chose to switch to 640x480 or 800x600, it would be as sharp as it was at 1024x768.
The LCD nextse7en suggested, the Camos, is fixed at 640x480. There are others with multi-res native resolutions of 800x600 and 1024x768. My question here is, if one were to go with the 1024x768 at that size and decided 800x600 worked better later, there would be a significant loss of clarity as the image was up res-ed. So it would be best to pick the monitor with the highest acceptable native resolution to begin with. 640x480 is going to be the closest to the original 512x342 resolution, but 800x600 should be perfectly legible and yield more screen-space. I question whether I would want to really use 1024x768 at that size in any practical way.
I had not thought about using OS X. 800x600 is the minimum and many applications require 1024x768.
I found this one on eBay for an exceptional price, but it seems to indicate a native resolution of 640x480, though it claims to support SVGA and XGA, so that must mean it will up-res the higher resolution? On such a small screen perhaps that won't matter? For US $70 it seems worth trying.
I found this one on eBay for an exceptional price, but it seems to indicate a native resolution of 640x480, though it claims to support SVGA and XGA, so that must mean it will up-res the higher resolution? On such a small screen perhaps that won't matter? For US $70 it seems worth trying.
This one is exactly the one i used for my project. It doesn't show on eBay US, I don't know why.
I'll make some screenshots on mine to let you see!
Actually, as I said before, it does matter a lot in my opinion. Especially on such a small screen, the native resolution is way better than any re-scaled resolution.
I'll make some screenshots on mine to let you see!
You could easily build the enclosure for the back out of Lexan or plexiglass if you're going to paint it. Lexan is a little easier to work with and more durable in my opinion (doesn't crack or shatter), and you can get the stuff at the hardware store. And you're just building a rectangular prism I think. That's not difficult. Do get the special plexiglass cutting tool if you use lexan though because it won't snap if you just score it and try bending it. It's strong stuff. Either that or run it through a table saw. Once you glue it together, you can sand the edges and make it all look seamless.
I'm not sure exactly where you can get sheets of plastic but that could be a better alternative, maybe cheaper too. (Lexan isn't cheap, maybe 2x cost of normal plexiglass.)
I'm not sure exactly where you can get sheets of plastic but that could be a better alternative, maybe cheaper too. (Lexan isn't cheap, maybe 2x cost of normal plexiglass.)
A better idea than Lexan would be to use ABS sheets. Parts-Express.com has it in several thicknesses. It cuts easily with a hack saw and can be solvent-welded with MEK for an extremely strong bond. I love using the stuff for custom dash work in car audio installs.
The stuff from Parts-express comes in black, so it would already be color-matched for that guy.
I think platinum or beige-colored plastic would be hard to get in an exact match, although if Mac cases are made of ABS plastic, you could actually cut up a donor Mac case for a color match. I'd only recommend doing that if the donor case is already badly beaten, broken, and cracked! You could also cut up and use pieces from the donor monitor. That MEK stuff is like magic on ABS, it bonds instantly and dries fast because it's actually solvent-welding. MEK is also not known to be carcinogenic (but should be used with adequate ventilation). I've never seen ABS sheets at hardware stores, but car audio shops may have it. You can also cut up the shell of a broken discarded TV, radio, etc.
I think platinum or beige-colored plastic would be hard to get in an exact match, although if Mac cases are made of ABS plastic, you could actually cut up a donor Mac case for a color match. I'd only recommend doing that if the donor case is already badly beaten, broken, and cracked! You could also cut up and use pieces from the donor monitor. That MEK stuff is like magic on ABS, it bonds instantly and dries fast because it's actually solvent-welding. MEK is also not known to be carcinogenic (but should be used with adequate ventilation). I've never seen ABS sheets at hardware stores, but car audio shops may have it. You can also cut up the shell of a broken discarded TV, radio, etc.
I tried the Dremel diamond-cutting of a CRT front to put over a LCD on my Macminitosh/Macintosh SE/x mod (see thread). It looks great, and is IMHO much better than "over-modding" the case's back.
/facepalm. Of course!
One CC hack I recall had part of an Apple Stylewriter attached - the colour matched perfectly.
I had a strange idea - what if you found an even smaller LCD, and made the cut CRT into a back-projection screen? ie like one of those DIY home theatre projectors, but inside the Mac. The resulting image would be sitting perfetly on the curve of the CRT glass (in theory)
Excellent idea. Something like this would work perfectly. Just reverse the image and you're in business. This helps put it into perspective better.