Thread
XPostFacto
I've been reading threads on this board about XPostFacto and reading the program's FAQs since I want to try to put 10.2 on my Kanga. However, I am unclear on whether I can just install OSX alongside OS9. Is it possible to have both system folders on the same drive and just switch between them as needed, or will I have to erase the hard drive and partition it?
Yes, you can. That is Apple's preferred method of installing OS X, and the only reasonable way to do it on a PowerBook. The "Startup Disk" Preference Pane in OS X, and the same-named Control Panel in OS 9 will let you pick the individual OS, even if they are on the same partition.
Exactly what I needed to know. Thanks. Another question...is there any compelling reason to install 10.3 or 10.4 over 10.2? Kangas apparently have some issues with 10.3, and the XPostFacto site doesn't indicate whether 10.4 is supported at all on Kanga.
Can you even run OS X on a Kanga? I thought I remembered reading something on LEM that said Kanga was the only G3 Powerbook that COULDN'T run OS X.
The sweet spot for OS X on the Kanga is 10.2.6, as the video kext works at thousands - you can go to 10.2.8 but save the kext, and I believe the same for 10.3.
Also keep in mind OS X needs to be installed on the first partition of the HD, which has to be below 8GB in size. To keep it clean, partition the HD in two - the first 8GB for OS X, and the latter for OS 9.1 - files etc won't get messed up then.
Hoping to do the same with my Kanga soon
JB
Also keep in mind OS X needs to be installed on the first partition of the HD, which has to be below 8GB in size. To keep it clean, partition the HD in two - the first 8GB for OS X, and the latter for OS 9.1 - files etc won't get messed up then.
Hoping to do the same with my Kanga soon
JB
The Kanga was never supported by Apple to run Mac OS X, but it can run it with help from XPostFacto, same as installing OS X on a G3/G4 upgraded PCI Power Mac.
And be prepared for a glorious text show.
If i remember correctly the last time i installed XPostFactoid it had to be done from the internal CD drive ( could not use external computer or external CD drives ) and the OS X must be on CD.
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Be prepared to know what the force restart magic keys just in case the installation creates a KernalPanic.
Also be aware that the computer running OS X in what i refer to as emulation mode is sloooooow and sometimes just sllllllllllllooooooooow. Although it helps if you have MAXED the RAM.
Excuse me but you may already know all this stuff.
If i remember correctly the last time i installed XPostFactoid it had to be done from the internal CD drive ( could not use external computer or external CD drives ) and the OS X must be on CD.
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Be prepared to know what the force restart magic keys just in case the installation creates a KernalPanic.
Also be aware that the computer running OS X in what i refer to as emulation mode is sloooooow and sometimes just sllllllllllllooooooooow. Although it helps if you have MAXED the RAM.
Excuse me but you may already know all this stuff.
Emulation Mode?
Computing reproduce the function or action of (a different computer or software system).
That is not what I meant. You are saying that the computer is running OS X in "emulation mode".
Just what exactly is being emulated?
Just what exactly is being emulated?
My 8500 is a unsupported system for OS X but by running OS X with XPostFacto it is imitating a supported system. Therefore the 8500 is imitating or emulating a for real OS X capable machine.
For me it is no different when i boot into OS X in my G4 and then run OS 9 in "Classic" mode , as i understand it, the OS 9 "Classic" is running within OS X and it is emulating OS 9 and really not running what i call the "for real OS 9" which is why so many of my midi/audio programmes die when running in "classic" . But if i boot directly into OS 9 those very same programmes work.
No doubt you are more knowledgeable about the world of computers then i am and my wording obviously upset you. Sorry about that my friend.
For me it is no different when i boot into OS X in my G4 and then run OS 9 in "Classic" mode , as i understand it, the OS 9 "Classic" is running within OS X and it is emulating OS 9 and really not running what i call the "for real OS 9" which is why so many of my midi/audio programmes die when running in "classic" . But if i boot directly into OS 9 those very same programmes work.
No doubt you are more knowledgeable about the world of computers then i am and my wording obviously upset you. Sorry about that my friend.
It's VIRTUALASION for Classic mode, not emulation.
when i used xpostfacto on my 8600 (10.2), (please, if you try this, KEEP OS9 and do not raid the drives! if your back up battery is dead, you will be unable to boot your computer into an OS, and it is a pain to reinstall when it stops booting OSX and you forgot to check the box to install os9 drivers onto the hdds, i got frustrated and put my 8600 away for later) as far as i know, it was not an emulation. it acknowledged that the computer it was running on had a 604e cpu, not a G3 or G4. i think that xpostfacto simply disables the "locks" on the osx installer and when it boots up, and that it also installs drivers/kexts to support the older systems.
Anyway, good luck w/ your kanga, and let us know how it goes, i might try to put 10.2 or 10.1 on my hooper when i get more ram.
Anyway, good luck w/ your kanga, and let us know how it goes, i might try to put 10.2 or 10.1 on my hooper when i get more ram.
It's VIRTUALASION for Classic mode, not emulation.
Cool word.
Cool word.
Glad you made reference to keeping OS 9 stuff.
Before i XPOSTfactoid my 8500 i installed a second internal hard drive and installed OS 9. For me it was a scarry blaze of text when i ran XPOSTfacto: made a lot of errors and had to redo th e process a number of times before i was able to get the TIGER running. Had to use TIGER because i was able to scoff the first two CD's of 3 CD's in exchange for the Tiger DVD.
Hope the KANGA OS X installation goes smooth. Let us know please.
Actually virtualization. But I do not think XPostFacto even does that. It just installs some custom kexts and plays with the NVRAM does it not?
My problem is that I don't have OS9.1 install disks, so wiping the hard drive and partitioning is not a viable option. My plan was to just install OSX10.2 of some sort right on top of OS9.1. My understanding is that this is doable and I can just switch between System Folders using the startup control panel. One of my Kangas appears to have an 8.6 installation on it as well, and it looks like I can switch between it and 9.1. Haven't tried it because I'm not sure if the 8.6 install is any good, but in theory I could. The current drive has plenty of space for OSX with space left over, so once I get the system fully operational (it needs a new keyboard and PRAM battery) I'm going to try to track down some OSX CDs.The sweet spot for OS X on the Kanga is 10.2.6, as the video kext works at thousands - you can go to 10.2.8 but save the kext, and I believe the same for 10.3.
Also keep in mind OS X needs to be installed on the first partition of the HD, which has to be below 8GB in size. To keep it clean, partition the HD in two - the first 8GB for OS X, and the latter for OS 9.1 - files etc won't get messed up then.
Hoping to do the same with my Kanga soon
JB
Is it unusably slow? My Kanga is maxed out at 160MB RAM and like all Kangas is a 250MHz G3. Also, what is being emulated by XPostFacto? I don't have a good understanding of how it actually works to allow unsupported systems like the Kanga to run OSX, so I'm unclear on whether hardware on a newer machine is being emulated with software by XPostFacto. In my experience software emulation of hardware tends to be very slow.
I can't say it will work for you with a laptop, but when I installed the new 80 GB hard drive in my Power Mac G3 (rev. B) , all I did was format and partition the NEW drive then I copied over my entire OS 9.2.2 System Folder to it and it was bootable. I have had no issues with at so far. I also have made system 7 floppy boot disks the same way, except using just the minimum required files (Finder, System, Enabler etc).My problem is that I don't have OS9.1 install disks, so wiping the hard drive and partitioning is not a viable option. My plan was to just install OSX10.2 of some sort right on top of OS9.1. My understanding is that this is doable and I can just switch between System Folders using the startup control panel. One of my Kangas appears to have an 8.6 installation on it as well, and it looks like I can switch between it and 9.1. Haven't tried it because I'm not sure if the 8.6 install is any good, but in theory I could. The current drive has plenty of space for OSX with space left over, so once I get the system fully operational (it needs a new keyboard and PRAM battery) I'm going to try to track down some OSX CDs.The sweet spot for OS X on the Kanga is 10.2.6, as the video kext works at thousands - you can go to 10.2.8 but save the kext, and I believe the same for 10.3.
Also keep in mind OS X needs to be installed on the first partition of the HD, which has to be below 8GB in size. To keep it clean, partition the HD in two - the first 8GB for OS X, and the latter for OS 9.1 - files etc won't get messed up then.
Hoping to do the same with my Kanga soon
JB
That would probably work given the way that OS9 works. That being said, installing a new hard drive in a Kanga is a complete pain from what I've read in the service manual.I can't say it will work for you with a laptop, but when I installed the new 80 GB hard drive in my Power Mac G3 (rev. B) , all I did was format and partition the NEW drive then I copied over my entire OS 9.2.2 System Folder to it and it was bootable. I have had no issues with at so far. I also have made system 7 floppy boot disks the same way, except using just the minimum required files (Finder, System, Enabler etc).My problem is that I don't have OS9.1 install disks, so wiping the hard drive and partitioning is not a viable option. My plan was to just install OSX10.2 of some sort right on top of OS9.1. My understanding is that this is doable and I can just switch between System Folders using the startup control panel. One of my Kangas appears to have an 8.6 installation on it as well, and it looks like I can switch between it and 9.1. Haven't tried it because I'm not sure if the 8.6 install is any good, but in theory I could. The current drive has plenty of space for OSX with space left over, so once I get the system fully operational (it needs a new keyboard and PRAM battery) I'm going to try to track down some OSX CDs.The sweet spot for OS X on the Kanga is 10.2.6, as the video kext works at thousands - you can go to 10.2.8 but save the kext, and I believe the same for 10.3.
Also keep in mind OS X needs to be installed on the first partition of the HD, which has to be below 8GB in size. To keep it clean, partition the HD in two - the first 8GB for OS X, and the latter for OS 9.1 - files etc won't get messed up then.
Hoping to do the same with my Kanga soon
JB
I was thinking More along the lines of using SCSI (it does have a HDI 30 port or something, right?) to copy everything to another drive as a backup, then formatting and partitioning the drive in the kanga, and finally copying everything back to the drive (plus it defragments your files!)
Correct. In OS 9, the Startup Disk control panel was tweaked to facilitate easy switching between OS X and OS 9.
Keep in mind, however that its only OS 9.1, 9.2.1 and 9.2.2 that have the newer version of the Startup Disk control panel that allows you to switch between system folders. OS 9.0.0 and 9.0.4 still have the older version that only allows you to choose between different volumes.
If your current drive is bigger than 8GB, you can't install OS X on it. A Mac with "old world" ROMs like the Kanga can't boot OS X from anywhere beyond the first 8GB of the drive. OS 9 can be anywhere within the first 128 GB of a drive. If your drive is bigger than 8GB, you need to repartition it with a 7.9 GB first partition, which will hold the OS X system. OS 9 can be installed in that first partition or in a second partition which covers the rest of the drive. If your drive is smaller than 8 GB, then you have no problem, and can install OS X on top of OS 9. It may take a couple of shots with XPostFacto to get all the options right. There were a few where I had to guess and picked the wrong one, but eventually I got it right, and OS X worked very nicely until there was a major crash and everything had to be reinstalled again from scratch.
If you don't have install disks for OS 9, then risky behavior like XPostFacto may not be a good idea.
It's a 5GB drive...and I also just found 9.0.4 and 9.2.2 install discs. The 9.2.2 disc doesn't work in the Kanga though, it says it will only work in an iMac.
As best as I understand it OS 9.2.x is officially supported only on Apple G3 or later Macs (Beige G3 or later).
Do not attempt to install OS 9.2.x on any unsupported Mac unless you are willing to risk the chance the system won't boot, possible drive problems, etc. Also as i understand it the OpenGL 1.2.2 installed by OS 9.2.1 is not compatible with 3Dfx graphics cards if that matters to you.
When I used XPostFacto on my 8500/Sonnet G3 PCI card i only had 9.1 installed because when i did that i was completely stupid ( not that I am any wiser now ) as to how to use XPost or what OS 9 should already be installed. Plus i was not aware of this forum to help me thru the installation of Tiger on a unsupported Mac. I only knew that I had to have an 2nd internal hard drive because the factory drive was only 4 or so GB. I also learned the hard way that i could only use the internal CD driver for installation because using an external CD drive results in a failed installation. Since I had to use the internal 8500 CD drive the installation disks had to be CD's ( unless that has changed ). I was lucky to get an Apple tech guy to provide me with a copy of Tiger on CD at no charge. Well that's my sad story about installing OS X on my unsupported Mac.
Do not attempt to install OS 9.2.x on any unsupported Mac unless you are willing to risk the chance the system won't boot, possible drive problems, etc. Also as i understand it the OpenGL 1.2.2 installed by OS 9.2.1 is not compatible with 3Dfx graphics cards if that matters to you.
When I used XPostFacto on my 8500/Sonnet G3 PCI card i only had 9.1 installed because when i did that i was completely stupid ( not that I am any wiser now ) as to how to use XPost or what OS 9 should already be installed. Plus i was not aware of this forum to help me thru the installation of Tiger on a unsupported Mac. I only knew that I had to have an 2nd internal hard drive because the factory drive was only 4 or so GB. I also learned the hard way that i could only use the internal CD driver for installation because using an external CD drive results in a failed installation. Since I had to use the internal 8500 CD drive the installation disks had to be CD's ( unless that has changed ). I was lucky to get an Apple tech guy to provide me with a copy of Tiger on CD at no charge. Well that's my sad story about installing OS X on my unsupported Mac.
have OS9 Helper. http://www.os9forever.com/er, specifically: http://www.os9forever.com/os9helper.html
Just for my own understanding are you indicating that i should have installed 9.2.2 before installing OS X with XPostF ?
Also not sure i really understand what the advantage would be of having 9.2.2 on the original/primary hard drive when in most cases the primary objective of installing OS X via XPostF is to run OS X from mac hardware Apple does not support running OS X.
Personally I do log back in to the hard drive that has OS 9.1 ( using XPostF startup control application ) and then log into OS 8.6 ( on that same drive ) simply because most if not all my midi/audio programmes freeze in OS 9 which stands to reason since those programmes were written prior to OS 9 architecture.
I also learned that it is a good idea to partition the second internal drive and install OS X to both of those partitions.
... you.. just do not get it do you?
Not saying you have to install OS 9. Just saying that it can be done.
Not saying you have to install OS 9. Just saying that it can be done.
uhhh...
.. Answered!
Where did you hear that? And why should it be done?
Take it easy Mr MacJunky:
when you say
when i read your post i was not challenging what you said it was only that at the time of reading your post it was to me rather unclear . Furthermore, i am not a certified apple tech guy which is why i joined this forum not to challenge what was written by anyone only to learn and if we don't ask we never learn. If i make a mistake in replies or participating in the thread (s ) then there is a polite manner of correcting that for the benefit of all . Otherwise what's the point of having this forum in allowing the exchange of ideas and thoughts. As i noted when i first read about using XPost to trick my 8500 to run OS X there were no forums such as this one to guide me thru the process. As a result i had a horrible experience and what i call disastrous results whereby i had to turn to a local apple tech shop to get my 8500 working again.
So my friend if i offended you please accept my apology