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recommend a older laptop to me?

68kMLA Hardware 41 posts Jun 23, 2015 to Jun 25, 2015
Hi folks...

After I sold all my Macs but for my color classic, it seems hard to service it with out another working older Mac in the house.  I had to sell all but two computers because I am moving out of the country, and the country I am moving to will only allow me to bring in two computers.  So I kept my color classic and a dual boot ubuntu/PC box

My friend will be flying into Ecuador with no computers.  I was thinking about buying a Mac laptop that I can run a version of OS 7 on that he can put in his suitcase. I saw this on ebay:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/5300c-Color-monitor-Powerbook-Mac-Apple-1995-new-in-box-complete-factory-refurb-/171832610432?ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:US:1123

I sent the seller email asking for more info.

I wondered if that 53300C would do the job?  I do not know the Mac line of laptops from, say 1990 to maybe 1999.  It can run up to OS 9.22, but I will probably put a version of OS 7 on it.

Can someone recommend a laptop to me?  It would be nice if it had a CD reader and burner in it.  I do not know the first things about mac laptops from that era.

Thanks

jack

You're not going to find an Apple laptop capable of running System 7 that has a CD burner. Heck, the only ones that'd have a CDROM would be the crappy 5300, the 1400 and the 3400.

OK.  Thanks for the tip.  Can I buy a older laptop that has a SCSI external port on it?  I have a external Sun branded CD drive/burner that I can plug into the SCSI port on the back of my Color Classic.

jack

If you want a solid System 7 capable laptop, the 1400/133c or 166c are very nice little units that are reliable and fairly fast... if you want something a bit more usable, I'd consider something OS compatible, which will still be able to interface with OS7 via a network. If the CC has ethernet, try and find a Powerbook G3 Lombard (which are fairly common) or a Pismo( a little less common but much better machines)... if you only have localtalk and sneakernet to play with, get a PDQ or Wallstreet, but for gods sake not the 12" model.

Also... having read your last post, Lombard or Wallstreet/PDQ still retain a SCSI port. :)

Heck, the only ones that'd have a CDROM would be the crappy 5300, the 1400 and the 3400.
The 5300 has no CD-rom available (or you have a one of a kind one) but i agree with you, none of the remaining ones has a burner.

If you are looking for a system 7 able laptop, the 1400 will be my first choice, if not i agree with schmoburger, go for a Powerbook G3 series.

You might be able to mod a cd burner with the 1400. But you are better off with an external SCSI drive most likely.

Folks...

My Color Classic has a ethernet card in it (Farallon).  So I will look for a Powerbook G3 Lombard or a Pismo.

I sure apperciate all the tips and help!

Thanks

jack

For a System 7 machine, it would be on what is needed. Thing is you may need a CD-ROM Burner. 

Problem with the 1400 - very few with using System 7 to 9.1 (7.5.3 - is the minimal system), with the 1400/166 starting at 7.6.1. Also, it does have an internal CD Drive and PCMCIA Slots, it does not have a burner. You could try to hack a burner from a G3 but then you would need its extensions. If not you would need a SCSI CD ROM Burner.

Problem with the 5300 - many if you believe the whispers of the crowd. The problem here is that there is no Internal CD ROM Drive with the 5300. Thus there is not way to hack in a CD ROM Burner like on the 1400. You would need an external CD ROM Drive & Burner (just the burner as it would be the CD ROM Drive.) The 5300 can System 7.5.2 to 8.1

The 5300ce is the faster Powerbook between the 5300 and 1400. The proof is in the data bus speed transfers, The 5300's have a 33.33HMz data bus speed and the 1400 has a 33MHz data bus speed despite having the faster CPU. That means that things involving I/O, the 5300 is faster - by a tiny bit. Booting from a CF on the IDE or PCMCIA  with the same system and set up on both machines, the 5300 will boot faster than the 1400. But for computing (graphics, information processing, CPU Intensive tasks) the 1400/133 and 1400/166 beats the 5300 while the 1400/117 ties with the 5300.

For that you want and need, the 5300 would be good. The 1400/33 with the CD and Floppy drive options would be better. And I say that even though I love the 5300ce. In either case, you would need to get as much RAM for it as possible.

Also, since I know you need to set up your CC, you would need a CF -> IDE and CF to PCMCIA adapters. These things are only a couple dollars from ebay with the PCMCIA being a bit more expensive between $5 - $10. Once you have them you can set up the CF in the laptop and then transfer it to the CC when you are done.

- - - -

The problems I see with the 5300 in the box is that it can be a nightmare. People sell things in "New in a box" condition, not aware that with electronics the caps and batteries (in case of laptops) can break down and leak. And hard drives stick when sitting around with spinning for  long time. Thus that "New" machine can end up being a dead machine when you get it. I would send him a question to boot machine and see if it turns on and boots, and get a guarantee on that if you choose to get it.

This guy wants $300 (with free shipping) for his 1400/166. It is complete with all the options and a laptop carrying case. And its working (as per the photos shown). The details are here:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Antique-Original-condition-Macintosh-Powerbook-1400C-166-OS-7-6-1-/201369240295?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ee28ac2e7

That's an insane price for a 1400. They go for far less, regardless of accessories. The only way that'd be worth that is if it had the solar cover.

OK.  I will dig deep into all this additional info.  Thank you Falcon & Elfen.

What do you folks think of the Apple PowerBook G3 400 (Pismo)?  Will it run a classic OS like 7 something?  I have a full set of floppies to load 7.5.3 and upgrade floppys to upgrade to 7.5.5.  I do not think I am interested in OS 8.  For me, it is OS 7 something. I need a Mac laptop I can use to support my Color Classic.

I will start reading.  Thansk so much fo rthe tips!!!!

jack 

i have a super clean powerbook 170,  its in good shape, i just oiled the hinges.

Ebay Links (They are from Chinese sellers I dealt with in the past with no problems):

CF to PCMCIA Adapter ($2.55 - Free Shipping):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CF-Compact-Flash-Card-Reader-Adapter-Converter-to-PC-Laptop-PCMCIA-WW-/161670539997?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a450aadd

CF to PCMCIA Adapter w/ 128MB CF ($10 - Free Shipping):

http://www.ebay.com/itm/STEC-128MB-COMPACT-FLASH-MEMORY-CARD-128-MB-Type-I-CF-to-PCMCIA-adapter-/261181967633?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3ccfa88d11

Note: There are other lower cost PCMCIA adapters but they do not have the metal shield to protect the CF Guide rails with. These do (the first more than the second). Believe me, those without the metal guard make a disgusting cracking sound then you sit on them - It's happened to me twice.

CF to Laptop IDE ($1.80)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pin-bare-Laptop-44-Pin-Male-IDE-To-CF-Card-Adapter-W8-/321766148948?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_2&hash=item4aeac1cb54

CF to Laptop IDE ($2.10)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CF-To-44-Pin-Male-IDE-Adapter-PCB-Converter-As-2-5-IHDD-Drive-For-Laptop-fad-new-/321712883971?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4ae7950903

Note: In both cases it looks like Pin #20 on these adapters need to be removed or bent out of the way.

My experience with these Chinese sellers are that they are fast in their deliveries of 2 to 3 weeks and their products come out fine. Only once when I bought a batch of 20 or so CF->IDE adapters was 1 bad. After exchanging a few emails, I sent them the bad adapter and got a replacement in less than a month later (2 weeks going there and 2 weeks going back to me). But be aware that a CF->IDE adapter might come to you bad.

Hong Kong sellers have a lower price but my experience with them is that it can take 6 weeks for the item to arrive. Which is funny, because the things being sold are identical between the sellers.

You can search ebay for the adapters if you like. US Sellers have a higher price and sometimes charges for shipping, but will get to you in a couple of days.

OK.  I will dig deep into all this additional info.  Thank you Falcon & Elfen.

What do you folks think of the Apple PowerBook G3 400 (Pismo)?  Will it run a classic OS like 7 something?  I have a full set of floppies to load 7.5.3 and upgrade floppys to upgrade to 7.5.5.  I do not think I am interested in OS 8.  For me, it is OS 7 something. I need a Mac laptop I can use to support my Color Classic.

I will start reading.  Thansk so much fo rthe tips!!!!

jack 

 
A Pismo/Lomdard/Wallstreet needs OS 8.0 minimum. They do have a floppy adapter but they are hard to find.

That's an insane price for a 1400. They go for far less, regardless of accessories. The only way that'd be worth that is if it had the solar cover.
That's the 1400C, with the better active matrix screen. Given that the price is high, it is working as per the pics showing it, and has everything. All other 1400s I seen today (6/23) on ebay are under $100 in AS-IS/For Parts Condition. Unless one wants to practice 1400 repairs, no one needs a headache.

The only way out of it is if somebody on the forum is selling a working 1400 with the CD and Floppy options with a powerpack for under $200.

I recommend the Macintosh Portable.

^ --- The portable is a pretty cool machine!   :)

but if you are pretty solid on color, then the powerbook 180c or the powerbook 540c might be a good choice too.  I have a couple 540c's they are Active Matrix color.   The 540c is kinda like a Color Classic II in a Laptop.  but with the 640x480 mod already done. I should take one apart and spray the plastics Platinum.

11348345_832413833519937_583471016_n.jpg.27ca1b0bffe5d84821a9357c6217dd28.jpg


Is that your personal 540c, Uniserver?

If so, it looks really nice (aside from the writing along the top bezel).

c

p.s. If you need some parts for a 520/520c, I'll trade them with you for a 5xx power adapter!

oh no cc,  that is just a (google images) photo.  I don't have an extra PB5XX adaptor right now buddy.  

In discussing details with mraroid in PM, he wants to use a CF as a SSD in a CC with a CF -> SCSI adapter. Thing is partitioning, formatting and installing System 7 the CF for this. Without use of a CD ROM Drive, this is not possible directly to the CC as it would need an external Apple Branded CD ROM Drive like the 300 or 600.

The only remaining solution is a laptop that can take a CF into a PCMCIA and through System 7 partition and format it, then put the OS on it. This only leaves a handful of laptops that can do this. He could use anything from 500 series, 190, 5300 or 1400 - all have a PCMCIA Slot and can support System 7. But to do this, he will need a CD ROM drive. With the 500, 190, and 5300, he would need an external SCSI Drive like the Apple 300 or 600. The 1400 is the only laptop that has the CD ROM Drive and supports System 7.

What 68K PowerBook other than the 190 or 500 series can support PCMCIA? I do not remember any.

This actually makes no sense if the idea is actually to get a bridge from a PC to the Color Classic...

Mraroid, get a $10-20 USB floppy drive and use Sheepshaver.  Save your third quota'ed computer for something else.

This actually makes no sense if the idea is actually to get a bridge from a PC to the Color Classic...

Mraroid, get a $10-20 USB floppy drive and use Sheepshaver. Save your third quota'ed computer for something else.
USB floppy drives don't write Mac 800K floppies.

And the Color Classic has an 800k floppy drive??

Plan for the future.

No! The Color Classic (like all Macs of that vintage) have SuperDrives, meaning they can read and write 1.44 MB disks. The newest Macs to have only an 800k drive, I think, were the Plus, early/non FDHD SE, and original Mac II. Everything subsequent to those models and up to the iMac had SuperDrives as standard.

That being said, if you can manage it, using Sheepshaver with a USB floppy drive on your PC should work perfectly fine, because you don't need to work with 800k disks to get stuff to your Coloir Classic.

EDIT: Assuming you don't end up with a Plus or SE someday, as TheWhiteFalcon predicts :)

c

p.s. You should invest in a FloppyEmu at some point, as they are incredible, and they will render this whole USB-floppy-on-a-PC thing moot, as you can just plunk your images on an SD card (regardless if they're 400k, 800k, or 1.4 MB), plug the SD card into the FloppyEmu, and plug the FloppyEmu into the Mac you wish to transfer stuff to. There is also working HD20 emulation built in as well, so you can take your Sheepshaver/MinivMac image whole and put it straight onto an SD card and mount it on your real Mac.

Obviously... (Probably the SE -- I didn't know the Mac II shipped with an 800k drive also.)  Hence a floppy bridge from a PC to a Color Classic will allow portable use of a SuperDrive... (plan for the future.  in Boy Scouts it was "Always be prepared.")

Yes, the first Mac to have SuperDrives was, I believe, the IIx (followed shortly by the SE/30, which was the first compact Mac to be so equipped).

c

By release date it'd be the IIx, going by everymac - SE/30 was released exactly 4 months later.

Correct! Those were my findings as well.

c

Does your friend actually want a retro laptop or something more modern - I'd look into a Macbook which would you could probable get the for the same coin as a vintage Mac, assuming if sourcing from eBay.

What 68K PowerBook other than the 190 or 500 series can support PCMCIA? I do not remember any.
Those are the only two that are 68k, and the 500 series is not 100% compliant with the PCMCIA standard, even with a Rev C. card cage, which is extremely hard to find. If you want a 68k machine that can do PCMCIA natively, it has to be the 190.

I remember that discussion, Parallel.

Thanks for reminding me.

I went with the 170 simply because it works with OS 7.1 and the 640x400 mono TFT has the same look as a compact. 68K Mac laptops are brittle badly designed pieces of junk which is why I have a couple parts machines just to get that one 170 perfect. Gaming was not something I want to do on a 68k mac laptop so if you do then a 68K color TFT model like a 540c would be a better choice.

Hi folks...

Elfen - thanks for the links.  I buy a lot of stuff directly from China and I have had no problums.

I bought a external SCSI CD drive/burner.  It is made by Sun.  It came with an adaptor and cable so I can plug it into my Color Classic.  I have been able to boot my Color Classic and I have a Mac CD that I can drop into this external SCSI drive and I can see the CD on my desktop. I can open it, and I believe install software onto my Color Classic from this disk.

The external Sun CD drive/burner is model # GWV611T (PN: 599-2147-01).  I have been unable to find any literature for it. I bought it used, cheap, but it seems to run just fine.

My thought was to burn a CD-R as a boot disk that would boot to a Mac OS - version 7 something.  But also on this CD would be non apple software that would let me partition and init the CF card.  I bought a CF AztecMonster CF-3.5inc. SCSI Converter Card:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CF-AztecMonster-CF-3-5inc-SCSI-Converter-Card-New-Condition-for-AKAI-E-mu-/261937236424?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cfcad09c8

It bolts perfect to my Color Classic plastic sled that my SCSI hard drive is on. I have swapped some email with Manabu Sakai in Japan (the fellow who built this card), and he directed me to some non apple software that he says will format and init any CF card.  As my CC is taken apart now and the floppy (with this partition software on it) has no name on the floppy other then "Driver", and I forgot to write down the name of the software, I can't tell you the name of it until I can read the disk.  If it is legal to give it away I am happy to give it away free to anyone here who might want it. Manabu believes it is the best software to use for this, as well as other format and init applications for Macs.

Soooooooo....  maybe I can get away with not buying a older Mac laptop if I could figure out a way to burn a boot CD with this partition software on it.

I searched the web looking for a directions on how to burn a boot floppy or a boot CD using a version of OS 7.  I could not find any.

Maybe someone knows of a web site I can go to read up on how to do this?

Do you think I need a second Mac (Lombard for example) to support my Color Classic? I do not want to be stuck in Ecuador and then find I can't install or support something or install something, or fix something on my Color Classic with out having a second Mac with me.

So if need be, I can buy a Lombard (or something else that I can plug my external SCSI optical drive into) and have my buddy bring the laptop into Ecuador when he flies in. If the Mac laptop I bought has no built in CD burner, then I would need a Mac laptop that can support my Sun Microsystems SCSI CD reader/burner.

Also, do I understand correctly that the Lombard shipped as either 333Mhz or 400Mhz?

Are after market laptop batteries still available (I am not taking about the small internal logic board battery).  I don't need them, but just asking.  I have a external USB floppy drive.  Do you think it might work if I plugged it into a USB port on a Lombard?

Sorry for the many questions!  I am still reading all your posts and following links.

Thanks for all the great support.  I hope I can return the favor some time.

jack




 

i have a super clean powerbook 170,  its in good shape, i just oiled the hinges.
Thanks Uniserver.  I wil look into that model as well.

jack

No! The Color Classic (like all Macs of that vintage) have SuperDrives, meaning they can read and write 1.44 MB disks. The newest Macs to have only an 800k drive, I think, were the Plus, early/non FDHD SE, and original Mac II. Everything subsequent to those models and up to the iMac had SuperDrives as standard.

That being said, if you can manage it, using Sheepshaver with a USB floppy drive on your PC should work perfectly fine, because you don't need to work with 800k disks to get stuff to your Coloir Classic.

EDIT: Assuming you don't end up with a Plus or SE someday, as TheWhiteFalcon predicts :)

c

p.s. You should invest in a FloppyEmu at some point, as they are incredible, and they will render this whole USB-floppy-on-a-PC thing moot, as you can just plunk your images on an SD card (regardless if they're 400k, 800k, or 1.4 MB), plug the SD card into the FloppyEmu, and plug the FloppyEmu into the Mac you wish to transfer stuff to. There is also working HD20 emulation built in as well, so you can take your Sheepshaver/MinivMac image whole and put it straight onto an SD card and mount it on your real Mac.
CC-333....

I have a external USB floppy drive.  It works on my ubuntu/PC box.  So, do I understand you correctly that in that I can plug my floppy drive into a PC, and then run PC software called Sheepshaver/MinivMac?  I can down load or move Mac software to my PC (?) and then burn it to a floppy?  I do not know what FloppyEmu is.  Is this some kind of software that will do Mac software emulation?  Can I do the same thing and burn a CD-R on my PC and somehow burn a Mac boot disk and add my Mac partition and init software to this CD?

jack

jack

Actually, if you want a Mac OS utility that manages CF cards no problem, try Hard Disk SpeedTools. It grows in the garden and worked perfectly for my CF -> SCSI adapter in my PB 540c. It was able to detect the unformatted card, init it, partition it, format it, and everything. Perfectly compatible with System 7.1. Its the only utility I know of that can do that. The FWB software can't see a CF until its been inited, Hard Disk Speedtools doesn't have that limitation.

OK.  I will look for Hard Disk SpeedTools software.  Now all I need to know is, can I take my working CC II running 7.5.3 and my external SCSI CD burner/reader and make a Mac boot disk with this software on it?

The one Mac branded CD I do own, will boot to a desktop on my Color Classic.  I think if I remove that CD, and then drop in another CD with Hard Disk SpeedTools on it, my Mac will not like that.  ???

So that is why I want to make a CD Mac boot disk with software like Hard Disk SpeedTools on that boot disk.  But I do not know how to do that.

jack

Make an ISO of the CD, load the ISO as non-read only in sheepshaver/mini vmac, add HDST to it inside the emulator, reburn the CD with the tools on it, and you should be good to go.

I do stuff like this all the time with Mini VMac and PowerISO on my Windows 8.1 system.

Also, my hint before on where to find it seems to have gotten lost. It grows in the garden. Do a search for Macintosh and Garden in any major search engine and you will most likely find what you are looking for.

Thanks Paralel....  I have down loaded all the files, plus 7.5.3 into my PC.  I will try to make a boot CD.  If this works, I do not have to buy another mac to support my color classic.

I found the link to Macintosh garden.  It is here:

http://macintoshgarden.org/

Great stuff.

I believe my CC is on line.  But the only site I went to was http://www.google.comand recieved a lot of java errors.  Is any one running a 68K friendly web site that Netscape 3.0 can connect to?

Thanks again for all the help.

jack