Thread
Laser Printers: Vintage vs New(er)
I've decided I want a laser printer for home. Mainly because my HP all-in-one that is a few years old sucks, at least as a printer. If it decides to suck up all the paper at once and then print a little bit on each page, relegating them all to the scrap paper pile, one more time it might just go out the window. I haven't been to thrilled with other "new" printers I've encountered.
I've got a LaserJet 5N at work w/ 500 sheet tray and duplexer which until we just got a whole bunch of 4600dtns basically meant I had the "best" printer since it was the only one out of 35+ that could do duplex. I was envied [
] ]'> (As an aside I'll say I wish I could hit employees sometimes. On guy told me he printed 2-7 page documents totaling 2500+ pages single sided and then used the copier to make double-sided copies. Part of the reason it took him a year to complete a job I redid for an update in two days) And I like it because I only use a toner cartridge about every year. It doesn't jam much and my office isn't the best humidity and temp wise.
So, do I make this simple and just go out and buy a new LaserJet (or other brand)? Has to have a network card, do duplex, and I'd like to keep it under $350 and even that's a bit high. I don't need it to be all that fast. I'll have to do some testing tomorrow at work and see how my 600 dpi compares to 1200 dpi for the sort of things I print (mainly text). I'd like it to hold some envelopes and not in a way that even if I feed one at a time it gets snatched out of my hand and immediately gets just crooked enough to look like crap. Which has happened with every printer I've ever had. I've read that the envelope feeder attachment for the 5N works well. If I did go for an older model (which would probably be the 5M, Mac model with PS which the 5N lacks) it would not be a totally refurbished one, that's too much. I'd try to spot a decent one on ebay or maybe even find one locally.
And now I remember the Deskjet 820cse I bought back in 1996. Its a windows only printer so I ended up giving it to my parents once I started using Macs. They used it up until Jan of this year when I bought them a photo printer (to stop my dad from buying incredibly expensive paper and printing photos with the old inkjet!!!). It never had a problem. Still works fine and is still hooked to their PC since I told them to use up the last of the inks they had.
You know I'm asking this here since I know some of you are gonna say "vintage" as a reflex.
So what have other people's experiences been with old vs new? I've heard of people who still use LaserWriter IIs and I bet we've got at least one here.
I've got a LaserJet 5N at work w/ 500 sheet tray and duplexer which until we just got a whole bunch of 4600dtns basically meant I had the "best" printer since it was the only one out of 35+ that could do duplex. I was envied [
] ]'> (As an aside I'll say I wish I could hit employees sometimes. On guy told me he printed 2-7 page documents totaling 2500+ pages single sided and then used the copier to make double-sided copies. Part of the reason it took him a year to complete a job I redid for an update in two days) And I like it because I only use a toner cartridge about every year. It doesn't jam much and my office isn't the best humidity and temp wise.So, do I make this simple and just go out and buy a new LaserJet (or other brand)? Has to have a network card, do duplex, and I'd like to keep it under $350 and even that's a bit high. I don't need it to be all that fast. I'll have to do some testing tomorrow at work and see how my 600 dpi compares to 1200 dpi for the sort of things I print (mainly text). I'd like it to hold some envelopes and not in a way that even if I feed one at a time it gets snatched out of my hand and immediately gets just crooked enough to look like crap. Which has happened with every printer I've ever had. I've read that the envelope feeder attachment for the 5N works well. If I did go for an older model (which would probably be the 5M, Mac model with PS which the 5N lacks) it would not be a totally refurbished one, that's too much. I'd try to spot a decent one on ebay or maybe even find one locally.
And now I remember the Deskjet 820cse I bought back in 1996. Its a windows only printer so I ended up giving it to my parents once I started using Macs. They used it up until Jan of this year when I bought them a photo printer (to stop my dad from buying incredibly expensive paper and printing photos with the old inkjet!!!). It never had a problem. Still works fine and is still hooked to their PC since I told them to use up the last of the inks they had.
You know I'm asking this here since I know some of you are gonna say "vintage" as a reflex.
So what have other people's experiences been with old vs new? I've heard of people who still use LaserWriter IIs and I bet we've got at least one here.
I use a LaserWriter Select 360 (circa 1993) for everyday use and it runs fine. It prints at 600dpi and I have printed entire books with it before. The only problem is that it doesn't have an ethernet port so to network it I use an ethernet to Localtalk adaptor. It is also a little slow compared to modern laser printers, especially with graphics.
I've never needed to buy a new printer as most of my needs are for black & white laser printing. The LaserWriter Select 360 was in a bin at the local school so I rescued it and then a few weeks later I rescued another. So if the first one ever dies I have a spare!
I've never needed to buy a new printer as most of my needs are for black & white laser printing. The LaserWriter Select 360 was in a bin at the local school so I rescued it and then a few weeks later I rescued another. So if the first one ever dies I have a spare!
Is there an equivalent thing for making USB printers into ethernet printers?
Erm, a cheap PC with printer sharing set up? 
Yeah, I was just wondering if there was a way that didn't require my main PC to be running in order to print something from somewhere else, but maybe not (or not something easily obtainable anyway). I couldn't even get the thing to print to a Windows shared printer from OS X to work when I tried it before, I will have to give it a go again some time and get you guys to help me if I still can't get it going :I
I got an amazing deal on a Samsung color laser recently. The Office Max near my house had them marked down to $179.99 but the one I got was a demo model that was marked down even further to $150. It has these stickers on one side that you see on floor models to draw attention to them, but I don't care about that. It's a CLP-600N and it has an ethernet port. A wireless card is optional, but I didn't get that. I am trying to source one, but the only places I can find so far that sell it separately are in Europe. It's not a big deal, though, as I have it plugged in to my wireless router, so I have to send my documents through the router instead of directly to the printer.
Hmmm, new vs old feed feets! How to explain... [] ]'>
There's usually one or more cam shaped rotating rubber feet which swing around and try and grab one and one only sheet of paper off the stack. When the cam first touches the top sheet the pressure is very gentle, and it is at this very moment that the tacky rubber must grab and get the sheet moving, because once moving the friction is much reduced, due to a trapped air cushion. If there is any slippage in startup, the cam's further rotation inwards towards the paper stack puts more pressure on multiple sheets and tends to lock them together. As the pressure mounts with further cam rotation, eventually even a worn, oxidized, slick rubber cam grabs the top sheet, which by now is partially pressure welded to several others below and proceeds to feed the collection in to piss you off. Bottom line: top sheet paper motion must start before pressure mounts and squeezes out the thin air layer between each sheet in the stack.
Rubber tends to get hard and slick with age, due to oxidation particularly from ozone from the laser printer drum corona wire but also just from normal air. Replace the feets or get some MG Chemicals Rubber Renue (100 ml bottle, use outside with good ventilation, do not use fingers, use a swab) to recoat the feed feets and give them some tack. The Rubber Renue product is also excellent for reconditioning the guide rollers and getting vintage imagewriter printers to feed straight again, if any of you have these beasts still around.
] ]'>There's usually one or more cam shaped rotating rubber feet which swing around and try and grab one and one only sheet of paper off the stack. When the cam first touches the top sheet the pressure is very gentle, and it is at this very moment that the tacky rubber must grab and get the sheet moving, because once moving the friction is much reduced, due to a trapped air cushion. If there is any slippage in startup, the cam's further rotation inwards towards the paper stack puts more pressure on multiple sheets and tends to lock them together. As the pressure mounts with further cam rotation, eventually even a worn, oxidized, slick rubber cam grabs the top sheet, which by now is partially pressure welded to several others below and proceeds to feed the collection in to piss you off. Bottom line: top sheet paper motion must start before pressure mounts and squeezes out the thin air layer between each sheet in the stack.
Rubber tends to get hard and slick with age, due to oxidation particularly from ozone from the laser printer drum corona wire but also just from normal air. Replace the feets or get some MG Chemicals Rubber Renue (100 ml bottle, use outside with good ventilation, do not use fingers, use a swab) to recoat the feed feets and give them some tack. The Rubber Renue product is also excellent for reconditioning the guide rollers and getting vintage imagewriter printers to feed straight again, if any of you have these beasts still around.
Well, for me new...
It was the liberation of the year, you see?
I was at the thrift store and I was looking at the crappy P4s,P3, ect... I stumbled over to the printer department and lo and behold, a LaserJet 1012! I asked how much it was, the guy slapped an $8 price tag on it! I ran home, plugged it in and it had a full toner cartridge and a 1500 page count! Very basic laser printer, but my entire family can print to it cause i have it set up for printer sharing... Also, I was at Best Buy the next day...They had it on "Blow Out" for...159.99) )
It was the liberation of the year, you see?
I was at the thrift store and I was looking at the crappy P4s,P3, ect... I stumbled over to the printer department and lo and behold, a LaserJet 1012! I asked how much it was, the guy slapped an $8 price tag on it! I ran home, plugged it in and it had a full toner cartridge and a 1500 page count! Very basic laser printer, but my entire family can print to it cause i have it set up for printer sharing... Also, I was at Best Buy the next day...They had it on "Blow Out" for...159.99
) )
Well I just won a LaserJet 5M on ebay, only 7K pages. Look to be clean and nice and white, unlike the one I have at work that is badly yellowed. Total pice with shipping = $95. Looks like a duplex will run me $50 shipped. No toner with the printer though so that's about another hundred or so for a high capacity genuine HP cartridge.
I found a LaserJet of some sort on my trip out on garbage day, but I have enough printers already so I left it. I did think to open it up and snag the toner cartridge, though, as the early Laserjets use the same carts as the Laserwriters.
I have 3 lasers in the house: Epson Actionlaser 1500 (upgraded to 5MB max RAM), NEC Superscript 870 (with a 16MB RAM SIMM), and an Apple 4/600 PS. The 2 PC lasers were purchased new, the Apple was used.
If I was to need a laser today I would get an old used HP that had ethernet and prints 11x17 with atleast 600 DPI resolution B&W. Color lasers are cheap these days, but for photos you are better off sending the digital files to Walmart to get them printed as needed. Inkjets are a pain in the rear and too costly.
If I was to need a laser today I would get an old used HP that had ethernet and prints 11x17 with atleast 600 DPI resolution B&W. Color lasers are cheap these days, but for photos you are better off sending the digital files to Walmart to get them printed as needed. Inkjets are a pain in the rear and too costly.
Photo printers still aren't to the point where the cost per print justifies owning one. Color lasers are definitely a steal these days, as they are faster and the cost per page is less than an inkjet. You may pay more for a toner cartridge but it also lasts a lot longer than an ink tank. A mistake a lot of people make is buying a printer as part of a bundle with a computer. The printers that are included in bundles are usually the most inefficient models the printer companies make. They will eat you out of house and home in ink expenses in short order. Cheap, entry level printers sold separately are also huge consumers of ink. I actually got a Canon 1000 printer free with purchase of a 4 pack of ink cartridges once, and it tore through those ink carts in a few weeks. I'll never do that again.
they make usb to ethernet adapters for printers
Update on my laser acquisitions. Laserjet 5M (14MB, 7K pages, network card), NEW duplexer, NEW 500-sheet tray, and real HP high-capacity toner cart. Total so far = $264 including all shipping. Haven't assembled it all yet (will do it after the move) but all in very-good to new shape. For that price I could get a new printer thats faster and is 1200 dpi capable, but I know the 5M won't be falling apart next year.
To me the question is whether the new lasers are very durable. It's easy to get a new 1200x1200dpi 20ppm ethernet laser for around $200, which considering I'll pay a ton of money just to have an older laser shipped to me, is a steal.
But man, those older Apple LaserWriters were tanks. Just keep putting toner in them and they'll keep printing. I'm not so sure about the newer ones.
But man, those older Apple LaserWriters were tanks. Just keep putting toner in them and they'll keep printing. I'm not so sure about the newer ones.
I'll back you up with the wisdom of that purchase. The 5M is very robust, and if you have problems repair information and parts are easy to find. It is also well supported by every operating system that understands PostScript or even PCL.
Quadraman, did you get the Samsung with those really easy to chance toner cartridges? If so, how do you like that printer?
I like it fine so far. I haven't had to change the toner yet, though.
I have a Samsung laser (mono) that is really good for toner, as there is a stopper at one end of the toner cartridge that can be removed and new toner chucked in there, without the need to buy an expensive new cartridge - not sure if that is what you're referring to or not.
Yeah, what would be difficult to change about a toner cart?
toner carts are easy as pie to change out
I'm not sure about the internal arrangement of my printer, but I think I remember reading somewhere that these things come with 4(!) cartridges. Red, Cyan, Yellow and Black.
I like anything vintage
I have a LW 4/600 that's still in working condition. The problem is that the G5 only sees it occasionally. It will go for a long stretch just fine, then something unknown must change and it will be invisible to the Mac for a long time. I've been trying to set it up one of my Unix boxes as a CUPS print server, as they all see it reliably, and CUPS is probably a more reliable standard (as far as OS X goes) than the geriatric AppleTalk the printer uses.
I got that printer second-hand about 6 years ago, and it was at least that old when I got it. If only it had the memory upgrade, that would help speed it up quite a bit. It really chugs sometimes, trying to chew through modern print jobs.
I got that printer second-hand about 6 years ago, and it was at least that old when I got it. If only it had the memory upgrade, that would help speed it up quite a bit. It really chugs sometimes, trying to chew through modern print jobs.
I have a Samsung ML-1710, and I love it. albeit, it's USB, but we are like on our third toner cartridge and have printed out about 23,000 pages (with the toner saver on) and the carts. are only $70/piece. Which is not bad, but considering my mom printes out simple pictures on it, that's fine. We have an Epson CX4200 All-in-One, and after printing like 10 photos, the ink was gone. on a brand new ink set!!! (not the ones that shipped with the printer, these were Epson Retail). On top of that, when we got the printer, it was like $400, and the cartridges cost $40 for each color it uses!! (this includes black too!)
talk about a Piece of crap! The thing can't print that good (it has been known to smear) and it's expensive to run. So we don't even use it for prints. we just use it for scanning. When contacting Epson about how fast the ink went, epson said it was normal. The worst part?? it wasn't even full DPI
We are STILL pissed about that. It cost us like $700 and we printed 10 pictures, and we can't use it!
talk about a Piece of crap! The thing can't print that good (it has been known to smear) and it's expensive to run. So we don't even use it for prints. we just use it for scanning. When contacting Epson about how fast the ink went, epson said it was normal. The worst part?? it wasn't even full DPI
We are STILL pissed about that. It cost us like $700 and we printed 10 pictures, and we can't use it!
i too have moved from a 7 year old Hp injet printer over to a Hp Laserjet 1200 i got local for $50
I'm doing the opposite of most people's pet peaves, and instead of not searching to see if a question has been asked, I'm not searching to see if an answer has been replied. I have to guess someone already mentioned it, but the thread is so long!
...There are network devices made by netgear/linksys/etc that are hubs with usb ports that can be used to make usb printers easily networkable.
Nathan
We recently had to bring in new lasers at work. I got LJ 1022s and tbh they are tacky and very lightly built, even compared to the 5 year old 1200s they are working alongside. They are more economical to run being HPs (no new fuser drums that cost as much as the printer every 50,000 copies) but even so, they aren't as nice as the old ones, despite being faster.
Which reminds me - anyone know how to rectify a slipping paper feed system on a LaserJet 5? Ours has been great until recently when it started jamming because the rollers are slipping. perhaps I should run some abrasive along the rubber rollers?
Which reminds me - anyone know how to rectify a slipping paper feed system on a LaserJet 5? Ours has been great until recently when it started jamming because the rollers are slipping. perhaps I should run some abrasive along the rubber rollers?
I have an LJ1022 and I like it. My other printers that I currently use are a LW 16/600 PS, Canon i450, and an ImageBanger.
The 1022 is indeed lightly built, I will be the first to tell you that. Where I came from we had several older model personal LJs still working fine. There was even a LJ III in the health office, still in service!
I will say right now that if there is any brand I can't stand it's Konica-Minolta. We have one of their copiers at work and it's been problematic.
The 1022 is indeed lightly built, I will be the first to tell you that. Where I came from we had several older model personal LJs still working fine. There was even a LJ III in the health office, still in service!
I will say right now that if there is any brand I can't stand it's Konica-Minolta. We have one of their copiers at work and it's been problematic.
Do a search on this very thread for wally's suggestion about Rubber Renue.