Thread
Quiet SE
Does anyone have any recomendations for a fan replacement for the SE? Something quiet?
Also, does a dual-floppy SE need a fan, or can the fan be slowed down at least?
Thanks,
Nathan
Also, does a dual-floppy SE need a fan, or can the fan be slowed down at least?
Thanks,
Nathan
You should be able to replace the case fan with pretty much any model that's the same size. I'd be willing to bet that pretty much ANY new fan will be quieter than the current model, but there are plenty of fans that are especially designed to be ultra quiet. Take a look at these:
http://www.quietpc.com/gb-en-gbp/products/casefans
http://www.quietpc.com/gb-en-gbp/products/casefans
IIRC, the SE's fan runs off the mains, which means that its rotation speed is tied to the mains frequency. If that's the case, then you can't practically slow it down.
I don't recommend taking the fan out altogether (although I've done that); you're just asking for trouble, even if it seems to work at first.
Best to get one of the quiet fans that ~tl talked about.
I've seen two common fans in the SE. One is the DC Pico Ace 25. These are good fans and run much quieter than the "rat cage" ones in the earliest SEs. The other is the Elima-Fan, which seems to be more common in later SEs. This one is quieter.
The Pico Ace 25 is pretty easy to find, I've seen other computers from the late 1980s using them. Note that the Elima Fan is made for many different models--if you find one in an LC don't try using it in the SE.
You will need to do a little soldering, if I recall, to replace an SE fan. It sits on the analogue board.
The Pico Ace 25 is pretty easy to find, I've seen other computers from the late 1980s using them. Note that the Elima Fan is made for many different models--if you find one in an LC don't try using it in the SE.
You will need to do a little soldering, if I recall, to replace an SE fan. It sits on the analogue board.
Thanks for all the info, I should be able to get what I need now.
Tom (or anyone I guess): what do you think about, in lue of pulling the fan, slowing it down? Too risky?
Nathan
Tom (or anyone I guess): what do you think about, in lue of pulling the fan, slowing it down? Too risky?
Nathan
In the light of tomlee59's observation that the fan is mains-powered, to slow it down will involve, eg, circuitry including a triac or the like. The resulting 100 or (in your case) 120Hz pollution inside the SE's case may mean that the game is not worth the candle.
de
de
As equill has so eloquently put it, it's not a good idea. Even if your SE happens to have a DC-powered fan, the most attractive option by far is simply to replace the fan altogether with a quieter one. So, we're back to ~tl' excellent recommendations.
Even if the original fan is mains powered, it would be easy enough just to remove it completely and rig up a new, quieter, fan from any 12v source inside the case. Does a dual-floppy SE have a spare hard drive power connector in the case or pin headers for one on the motherboard? If it does, then that'd be the easiest place to take it from I'd say. Even if it doesn't, it shouldn't be too hard to find 12v on the motherboard somewhere.
Unless that dual floppy SE has been modified to use a hard drive, there should be an open 50-pin SCSI connector on the logic board and the appropriate power connector on the analog board.
What does everyone think of cutting out the restrictive plastic grille on the back of the SE case?
It wouldn't be as pretty or collectable, but if one were using it for several years that way, I could see it being a good decision...
It wouldn't be as pretty or collectable, but if one were using it for several years that way, I could see it being a good decision...
Depends how you feel about putting a Rolls-Royce Merlin V16 engine in an Austin 10. It's been done ... At that time, an average petrol pump (bowser) at a garage could just keep up with the engine's idling speed.
de
de
I've actually heard of cars with the Merlin engine in them, and I would love such a thing.
I wouldn't want to do it to a car in mint condition or that I didn't intend to keep for years and years, though.
Last year, I installed a Silenx IXP-34-16 60x25mm fan in my SE/30. This 60mm fan is rated at 18cfm (at 2000rpm). The fan I removed from the SE/30 is an ELINA model# HDF6025L-12MB-1 (made by Inaba Denki). From what I've Googled, the ELINA is rated at 19CFM (3000rpm).
Of course, I checked the ELINA fan spec prior to ordering the Silenx 60mm. Because Silenx advertises the 60mm to be the same CFM as the ELINA but with a quieter operation, I decided that this Silenx 60mm fan would be the ideal replacement. And after buying it, I found the Silenx 60mm is very, very quiet -- almost inaudible. BUT, when comparing side by side with the ELINA, the ELINA moves (to my hand anyway) about twice as much air as the Silenx. So either the information I've googled about the ELINA being 19CFM is way off, or Silenx' claim of 18CFM is bogus.
So what I can say from this is, if you want a quiet 60mm fan that moves "a decent amount of air" then the Silenx IXP-34-16 is an excellent choice. But if you need it to move a lot of air (as much or more than a stock ELINA), you'd better select another fan brand.
All said, my SE/30 is very happy with the Silenx fan, as are my ears!
Of course, I checked the ELINA fan spec prior to ordering the Silenx 60mm. Because Silenx advertises the 60mm to be the same CFM as the ELINA but with a quieter operation, I decided that this Silenx 60mm fan would be the ideal replacement. And after buying it, I found the Silenx 60mm is very, very quiet -- almost inaudible. BUT, when comparing side by side with the ELINA, the ELINA moves (to my hand anyway) about twice as much air as the Silenx. So either the information I've googled about the ELINA being 19CFM is way off, or Silenx' claim of 18CFM is bogus.
So what I can say from this is, if you want a quiet 60mm fan that moves "a decent amount of air" then the Silenx IXP-34-16 is an excellent choice. But if you need it to move a lot of air (as much or more than a stock ELINA), you'd better select another fan brand.
All said, my SE/30 is very happy with the Silenx fan, as are my ears!
Sorry to unearth this thread, but would it ruin my SE to disable the fan if it was only going to be running HappyPlusClock?
As long as you run "HappyInternalThermometer" as well.
A MacPlus has no fan and can run an external floppy, so in theory.....
However, the Plus also has ventilation on the top of the case (which no SE model has).
You're best off hunting for one of the Elima Fans I mentioned in an above post from April 2007, they run pretty quietly.
You're best off hunting for one of the Elima Fans I mentioned in an above post from April 2007, they run pretty quietly.
Are they simple(ish) to install? I'm really going for silent.
You won't find much if you Google for "Elima" folks. Why? Because the fan is in fact "Elina." I know because I own several.
If one replaced the mains powered fan by a DC powered fan, a type with thermal control could be chosen. The 12 Volt DC power could be tapped with an Y shaped cable without modification to the board. With an appropriate adjusted controller such fan would pump exactly the amount of air needed. Because the stock fan is designed to keep the machine working under worst environmental condition, usually less cfm and less noise than the stock fan delivers will be required.
Thermal control units for DC powered fans can be obtained separately, allowing to place the temperature sensor near a hot spot. In case you want to upgrade a fan without integrated controller, be sure to get value for your money: Better units have some electronics inside, not just a resistor, and they should have controls to set the minimum voltage to let the fan rev up under any condition (unless they sense the revolution speed) and to throttle the maximum voltage, also. I modified a Q800 and a beige G3 with thermal control electronics for their fans - it's quiet a difference.
However, JDW's suggestion seems to be a solution that is secure, convenient to bolt on and, best of all, tested to be working in the given setup.
Thermal control units for DC powered fans can be obtained separately, allowing to place the temperature sensor near a hot spot. In case you want to upgrade a fan without integrated controller, be sure to get value for your money: Better units have some electronics inside, not just a resistor, and they should have controls to set the minimum voltage to let the fan rev up under any condition (unless they sense the revolution speed) and to throttle the maximum voltage, also. I modified a Q800 and a beige G3 with thermal control electronics for their fans - it's quiet a difference.
However, JDW's suggestion seems to be a solution that is secure, convenient to bolt on and, best of all, tested to be working in the given setup.
My Silenx 60mm fan still works great, puts out a good amount of air, and is so quiet you can't hear it! It wasn't that hard to install either.
Is it possible to install the Silenx fan without soldering? I was thinking that one could cut the old fan's wires as close to the fan itself as possible, strip off some insulation from them as well as those attached to the new fan, and then twist them together and wrap with electrical tape. It seems to be the simplest approach but I don't think that anyone has suggested it, so I wonder, am I missing something?
fogwalker, you can surely do the wire connects just as you describe, but as an electrical engineer and electronics "tinkerer" I abhor the thought! I want to know that 15 years from now my connections are still sound. twisting wires together isn't a good long term solution, and eletrical tape can come off after a few years, especially when there is a lot of surrounding heat (and humidity).
The "right" way to do it is to slip some appropriately sized heat-shrink tubing, cut to about an inch in length on each of the two wires, slide the tubing back far enough so your soldering iron won't shrink them, then solder both fan wires to the original wires on the analog board, then use a hair dryer or match to shrink the tubing. It will be a professional job that will lost as long as your classic Mac will. By the way, don't just strip off the insulation and touch both wires together and then solder them that way. Yes, the solder will stick them together, but it will be stronger and more electrically sound if you twist the wires together and then solder. Put a lot of heat on the wires and allow the solder to sink in deeply.
I know some of you lack skills and/or parts to do a job "right." But even here in outrageously expensive Japan I can pick up a cheap soldering iron for $9, solder for $3 more, and some heat-shrink for another $3. That's expensive for only one solder job, but cheap if you might be doing some electrical connects in the future.
The "right" way to do it is to slip some appropriately sized heat-shrink tubing, cut to about an inch in length on each of the two wires, slide the tubing back far enough so your soldering iron won't shrink them, then solder both fan wires to the original wires on the analog board, then use a hair dryer or match to shrink the tubing. It will be a professional job that will lost as long as your classic Mac will. By the way, don't just strip off the insulation and touch both wires together and then solder them that way. Yes, the solder will stick them together, but it will be stronger and more electrically sound if you twist the wires together and then solder. Put a lot of heat on the wires and allow the solder to sink in deeply.
I know some of you lack skills and/or parts to do a job "right." But even here in outrageously expensive Japan I can pick up a cheap soldering iron for $9, solder for $3 more, and some heat-shrink for another $3. That's expensive for only one solder job, but cheap if you might be doing some electrical connects in the future.
If you have no hard-disk then you should have a spare power connector. Get a mating connector for that and solder the fan to that connector, you have the choice of 5v or 12v to play with and no soldering the original machine.
I agree with Porter that a connector would be better than electrical tape, but solder and heat-shrink still beats a connector. You know this is true by logical deduction. Consider that intermittent connections in one of the connectors on the analog board of old Macs is often the cause of screen anomalies. Contacts oxidize over time and become loose. But again, soldered and heat-shrinked connections will last as long as the device you perform that job in.
I don't know why but I always mess that name up. I think it's because "Elima" makes more sense...it "elimi"nates heat.
fogwalker, in case you choose to buy your own soldering gear, be sure to get appropriate solder and flux or flux-containing solder for electronics repair purpose (a lot of electronics solder in fact is a tube of solder filled with a small amount of flux, allowing to do the work without applying flux to the connection before soldering). It is not the same stuff the plumber uses. Several kinds of soldering flux may corrode the circuit lines on the board or the wires, if not removed completely. So just ask for solder for electronics and you most likely will get something usable.
Thank you, JDW and register, for the detailed and helpful advice. It's nice to know how, as well as why, to do it the right way.