Thread
Migrating Vision 1.4 files to Logic Pro X via Studio Vision on Mac OS9.
The Trail of Tears
Project Goal: Migrating 264 Vision 1.4 files to Logic Pro X
Summary: It works! But it is going to take a million years to complete the project.
Current Challenge: Troubleshoot occasional type 2 errors and make overall process easier.
The Approach:
Step 1 Install SVP Demo with bundled OMS X.X onto Blueberry G3 running Mac OS 9.1. (done)
Step 2 Install Unitor family of drivers to run emagic MT4 hooked up to Emu Proteus 1. (done)
Step 3 Configure OMS by not clicking serial or printer port and allowing it to search for devices so that it will talk to MT4 USB midi interface. (done)
Step 3 Test if SVP Demo will open Vision 1.4 files and play them. (done)
Note it asks me to find the OMS studio setup file used to create the sequence file and if I want to make it current. I do. It asks me to remap some missing hardware. I do. The sequences play without problem.
Step 4 Replace SVP Demo with SVP PPC. (done)
Step 5 Export opened Vision 1.4 file from within SVP PPC and export it as SMF 1. (done)
Step 6 Move using Firewire drive to Mid 2010 27"iMac and import to Logic Pro (done)
Step 7 Wonder why rackmount Proteus sounds so much better than Logic's EXS24 using Emu's Proteus samples and why after so many years Logic is still not as good as Vision was for composition. (ongoing)
Current Issues:
Some songs create type 2 errors when trying OMS is trying to make their legacy studio setups current.
I tried turning off extensions.
I tried increasing the RAM to SVP.
Neither approach worked.
I would welcome any suggestions on how to debug the Type 2 error!
Thanks, and thanks to the forum for providing the links below that were essential.
How to install the SVP Demo and Studio Vision Pro PPC here:
http://vision.agektmr.com/Tips/en/Install.html
http://vision.agektmr.com/Tips/en/Install2.html
All of the Opcode software here:
http://web.archive.org/web/20090211171448/http://opcodeusers.com/opcode/vision.html
emagic mt4 drivers
http://web.archive.org/web/20020603152527/http://www.emagic.de/english/support/download/toolsmac.html
Stuffit available here:
http://my.smithmicro.com/stuffit-updates.html
Project Goal: Migrating 264 Vision 1.4 files to Logic Pro X
Summary: It works! But it is going to take a million years to complete the project.
Current Challenge: Troubleshoot occasional type 2 errors and make overall process easier.
The Approach:
Step 1 Install SVP Demo with bundled OMS X.X onto Blueberry G3 running Mac OS 9.1. (done)
Step 2 Install Unitor family of drivers to run emagic MT4 hooked up to Emu Proteus 1. (done)
Step 3 Configure OMS by not clicking serial or printer port and allowing it to search for devices so that it will talk to MT4 USB midi interface. (done)
Step 3 Test if SVP Demo will open Vision 1.4 files and play them. (done)
Note it asks me to find the OMS studio setup file used to create the sequence file and if I want to make it current. I do. It asks me to remap some missing hardware. I do. The sequences play without problem.
Step 4 Replace SVP Demo with SVP PPC. (done)
Step 5 Export opened Vision 1.4 file from within SVP PPC and export it as SMF 1. (done)
Step 6 Move using Firewire drive to Mid 2010 27"iMac and import to Logic Pro (done)
Step 7 Wonder why rackmount Proteus sounds so much better than Logic's EXS24 using Emu's Proteus samples and why after so many years Logic is still not as good as Vision was for composition. (ongoing)
Current Issues:
Some songs create type 2 errors when trying OMS is trying to make their legacy studio setups current.
I tried turning off extensions.
I tried increasing the RAM to SVP.
Neither approach worked.
I would welcome any suggestions on how to debug the Type 2 error!
Thanks, and thanks to the forum for providing the links below that were essential.
How to install the SVP Demo and Studio Vision Pro PPC here:
http://vision.agektmr.com/Tips/en/Install.html
http://vision.agektmr.com/Tips/en/Install2.html
All of the Opcode software here:
http://web.archive.org/web/20090211171448/http://opcodeusers.com/opcode/vision.html
emagic mt4 drivers
http://web.archive.org/web/20020603152527/http://www.emagic.de/english/support/download/toolsmac.html
Stuffit available here:
http://my.smithmicro.com/stuffit-updates.html
thanks for offering your expertise gary!
Hi Gary,
So first, thanks again for the suggestions.
I really appreciate it. I spent the evening diligently trying them out. I did not succeed.
I think you are on to something that there is something in the particular studio setup of some of the old files that makes SVP crash. That said, I haven’t managed to crack it.
So I tried the different ideas you suggest, summarized here:
First: Do the songs that trigger the errors ever open after retry, or do they absolutely crash every time?
It crashes every time. Oddly, the “SVP Demo” opened them but SVP PPC won’t. The problem is that the demo does not allow exporting SMF files.
Second: Where are your "new" OMS prefs? They should be in a folder inside an OMS folder inside the system folder - NOT inside the system folder preferences folder but just inside the system folder itself.
Yes, the are in System Folder/OMS Folder/OMS Preferences
If the "bad" tunes absolutely will not open without a crash, you need a different approach.
Ok!
1. A newer version of OMS. Preferably from the same era as the version of SVP. That will most likely be 2.3.8
Installing 2.3.8 fails in the middle of installation saying an unexpected error occurred installing the Proteus 2000. :-(
2. Decreasing the RAM to SVP
Same result.
3. Try to open them in SVP without making the setup current
Type 2 error
Now we're getting more frustrated - take a break.
True that.
4. Create an OMS studio setup file from scratch that matches the original setups from the 1.4 era.
In trying this it hung while searching for drivers after I clicked the modem and serial ports.
5. Create a new SVP setup file using the fake OMS setup. When you next try to open a "bad" file, start SVP first, then try to open a "bad" file.
See above.
I tried creating a fresh OMS setup that approximated what I thought might have been the configuration tied to the old files that are crashing. I remembered I used an Emax II on the modem port in addition to the Proteus 1 on the serial port. I tried doing a setup that used the MT4 over USB but told it there was a Proteus on port 1 and an Emax II on port 2.
Upon launching SVP PPC it asked:
Make a new set of instruments from the output devices and channels in the current Studio Setup?
Instruments which are currently in use and custom instruments (for example with bold face names that you typed in) will be preserved. This operation is not undoable.
[]Always make from Studio Setup which I left unchecked. Check this to remind you to update your instruments whenever the current Studio Setup changes.
[Don’t make][Make]
I tried [Make]
And left the []Always...box unchecked.
SVPPPC launched without problem.
I opened one of the files that have been working without a problem.
OMS threw a dialogue box:
The patches “All Proteus” do not match those in your current setup.
[Don’t][Make Current]
I chose [Don’t]
OMS: Would you like to keep patches that are saved with “All Proteus”? If not “All Proteus” will be permanently changed.
[Go Back][Change][Keep]
I chose [Keep]
This file that had opened in the past without problem opened again without problem.
I now tried opening a “bad” file.
When the File/open dialogue opened I left []Use setup instruments unchecked.
OMS threw a dialogue box:
The patches “All Proteus” do not match those in your current setup.
[Don’t][Make Current]
I chose [Don’t]
OMS: Would you like to keep patches that are saved with “All Proteus”? If not “All Proteus” will be permanently changed.
[Go Back][Change][Keep]
I chose [Keep]
It threw a type 2 error and had to reboot the machine.
I tried variations including:
checking the
(At this point OMS reported: In order to make the names in “All Proteus” current please be sure to manually load these patches into these devices: (It displayed two icons, one was the icon of the Proteus 1 instrument from the OMS current setup, the other icon looked like the icon of an OMS document and had the name of one of the old OMS setup files (from v1.4) called “All Proteus/Proteus 1”.
It once again threw a type 2 error.
Summary:
I feel like I have tried the permutations of the different choices available.
Would I be a quitter if I just worked to actually recreate the original hardware environment the files were built under? (get Vision 1.4 running on a MacClassic under OS7 using a serial Midi interface) and try it there? :-[
So first, thanks again for the suggestions.
I really appreciate it. I spent the evening diligently trying them out. I did not succeed.
I think you are on to something that there is something in the particular studio setup of some of the old files that makes SVP crash. That said, I haven’t managed to crack it.
So I tried the different ideas you suggest, summarized here:
First: Do the songs that trigger the errors ever open after retry, or do they absolutely crash every time?
It crashes every time. Oddly, the “SVP Demo” opened them but SVP PPC won’t. The problem is that the demo does not allow exporting SMF files.
Second: Where are your "new" OMS prefs? They should be in a folder inside an OMS folder inside the system folder - NOT inside the system folder preferences folder but just inside the system folder itself.
Yes, the are in System Folder/OMS Folder/OMS Preferences
If the "bad" tunes absolutely will not open without a crash, you need a different approach.
Ok!
1. A newer version of OMS. Preferably from the same era as the version of SVP. That will most likely be 2.3.8
Installing 2.3.8 fails in the middle of installation saying an unexpected error occurred installing the Proteus 2000. :-(
2. Decreasing the RAM to SVP
Same result.
3. Try to open them in SVP without making the setup current
Type 2 error
Now we're getting more frustrated - take a break.
True that.4. Create an OMS studio setup file from scratch that matches the original setups from the 1.4 era.
In trying this it hung while searching for drivers after I clicked the modem and serial ports.
5. Create a new SVP setup file using the fake OMS setup. When you next try to open a "bad" file, start SVP first, then try to open a "bad" file.
See above.
I tried creating a fresh OMS setup that approximated what I thought might have been the configuration tied to the old files that are crashing. I remembered I used an Emax II on the modem port in addition to the Proteus 1 on the serial port. I tried doing a setup that used the MT4 over USB but told it there was a Proteus on port 1 and an Emax II on port 2.
Upon launching SVP PPC it asked:
Make a new set of instruments from the output devices and channels in the current Studio Setup?
Instruments which are currently in use and custom instruments (for example with bold face names that you typed in) will be preserved. This operation is not undoable.
[]Always make from Studio Setup which I left unchecked. Check this to remind you to update your instruments whenever the current Studio Setup changes.
[Don’t make][Make]
I tried [Make]
And left the []Always...box unchecked.
SVPPPC launched without problem.
I opened one of the files that have been working without a problem.
OMS threw a dialogue box:
The patches “All Proteus” do not match those in your current setup.
[Don’t][Make Current]
I chose [Don’t]
OMS: Would you like to keep patches that are saved with “All Proteus”? If not “All Proteus” will be permanently changed.
[Go Back][Change][Keep]
I chose [Keep]
This file that had opened in the past without problem opened again without problem.
I now tried opening a “bad” file.
When the File/open dialogue opened I left []Use setup instruments unchecked.
OMS threw a dialogue box:
The patches “All Proteus” do not match those in your current setup.
[Don’t][Make Current]
I chose [Don’t]
OMS: Would you like to keep patches that are saved with “All Proteus”? If not “All Proteus” will be permanently changed.
[Go Back][Change][Keep]
I chose [Keep]
It threw a type 2 error and had to reboot the machine.
I tried variations including:
checking the
- Use setup instruments in the File Open dialogue
(At this point OMS reported: In order to make the names in “All Proteus” current please be sure to manually load these patches into these devices: (It displayed two icons, one was the icon of the Proteus 1 instrument from the OMS current setup, the other icon looked like the icon of an OMS document and had the name of one of the old OMS setup files (from v1.4) called “All Proteus/Proteus 1”.
It once again threw a type 2 error.
Summary:
I feel like I have tried the permutations of the different choices available.
Would I be a quitter if I just worked to actually recreate the original hardware environment the files were built under? (get Vision 1.4 running on a MacClassic under OS7 using a serial Midi interface) and try it there? :-[
cant u install Vision 1.4 on mac os 8.6 or 9.x ?
i heard from someone that u could do this.. in fact im pretty sure the installer file is on the board here somewhere
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=2368.0
i documented that this version is from 1993 in the above thread..
ok maybe im mistaken..
and its vision 1.02 that was posted here
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=2132.0
would locating a copy of 1.4 help?
if it was possible to install + run 1.02 it must be possible to do the same with 1.4
i also documented that there was a version 1.4 for windows 3.1 aswell
http://www.oldschooldaw.com/forums/index.php?topic=520.0
heres an ebay auction that lists vision 1.4 on 2 3.5" floppies
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Opcode-Vision-Galaxy-OMS-software-on-3-5-floppy-disks-MIDI-sequencer-for-Mac-/141711926113
i heard from someone that u could do this.. in fact im pretty sure the installer file is on the board here somewhere
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=2368.0
i documented that this version is from 1993 in the above thread..
ok maybe im mistaken..
and its vision 1.02 that was posted here
http://macos9lives.com/smforum/index.php?topic=2132.0
would locating a copy of 1.4 help?
if it was possible to install + run 1.02 it must be possible to do the same with 1.4
i also documented that there was a version 1.4 for windows 3.1 aswell
http://www.oldschooldaw.com/forums/index.php?topic=520.0
heres an ebay auction that lists vision 1.4 on 2 3.5" floppies
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Opcode-Vision-Galaxy-OMS-software-on-3-5-floppy-disks-MIDI-sequencer-for-Mac-/141711926113
This is nuts!
There's not one really good reason I can think of why this should be happening.
I'll tell you what, I'm willing to try this if you're OK with it: Stuff one of these *)^# files AND one of the "no problem" ones into a .sit and send them to me.
Let's see what happens on my system. either it will just work fine or it won't, but at least I'll have a better view of all this.
Either way maybe we'll learn something…?
Send to:Gary@Opcodesupport ha ha (Don't you wish?)
To: Gary@ModernBluesRecords.com
There's not one really good reason I can think of why this should be happening.
I'll tell you what, I'm willing to try this if you're OK with it: Stuff one of these *)^# files AND one of the "no problem" ones into a .sit and send them to me.
Let's see what happens on my system. either it will just work fine or it won't, but at least I'll have a better view of all this.
Either way maybe we'll learn something…?
Send to:
To: Gary@ModernBluesRecords.com
i bet its totally because of the oms version.
or perhaps its to do with the MT4 interfaces OMS driver..
http://web.archive.org/web/20020603152527/http://www.emagic-mirror.com/pub/drivers/u8omsdrv.sit
it may have some differences between the way it works and the older interfaces that would have been used at the time
of vision 1.4. remember thats emagic writing a driver for opcodes OMS.. presumably primarily for use with logic + the mt4
+ oms.. not vision!!
kzb; if u could share some photos of your mac classic running vision 1.4 for educational purposes that would be really cool
or perhaps its to do with the MT4 interfaces OMS driver..
http://web.archive.org/web/20020603152527/http://www.emagic-mirror.com/pub/drivers/u8omsdrv.sit
it may have some differences between the way it works and the older interfaces that would have been used at the time
of vision 1.4. remember thats emagic writing a driver for opcodes OMS.. presumably primarily for use with logic + the mt4
+ oms.. not vision!!
kzb; if u could share some photos of your mac classic running vision 1.4 for educational purposes that would be really cool
Lovely vintage piece. Cool that it gets a job done after so much time.