No more illegal than taping it and giving it to someone.

Terrorist!

Just do it.

I would say: Illegal
I don't know if it's illegal to borrow a VHS from someone, but I'm pretty sure it's illegal to "borrow" a DVD from someone over the internet, just as it is to "borrow" a CD from someone over the internet, so I don't think that it's different for TV shows.

If the shows are on cable I would guess that they get money from this, so you not having cable is like you downloading mp3s without buying the CD.

Uhhh, commercials?!?

I agree with drive-thru. Someone could bring a DVD over to my house and let me watch it, but that doesn't mean it's legal to download it over the internet. Same with TV shows.

Maybe i'm not the person to ask because I believe hacking should be legal but my pov on this is that its ok as long as you don't sell or give copy's cause the person distributing them to you is wrong of course that makes you an accessory(I think).

He isn't talking about dvds obviously. Stargate Atlantis is only going on the 5th episode.

Considering you don't pay for them anyway.. not illegal unless it expressly says so.

So if I had cable, It would be legal? Who am I stealing from? The cable company...the sci-fi channel?

Just curious. I asked the question because I don't know.

I really don't know exactly what the law on this is and, as we saw in the thread about copying songs in Australia, the law is very different in different countries.

From what I know/think I know/made up: you are allowed to copy stuff you are able to view on the TV as long as it is for your personal viewing. Technically then, the people distributing it are breaking the conditions/law/copyright by distributing it, and you're breaking the law by whatever the digital equivalent is of handling stolen goods (I guess you're part of the piracy chain).

No one's making any money from this distribution, so I don't think it's a major crime.
You asked in your post if it was illegal - my opinion is yes.

Edit: It could be argued (probably by the TV company) that if you could not download the shows & wanted to watch them then you would buy cable, so they would say that they're losing money.

If the rip includes commercials: legal, though your local cable provider might have some issues with it.

If the rip doesn't include commercials: illegal

I think that its ok if your on the oceon or in outer space but on earth land it could be either way

i wonder if its "legal" for me to download TV Shows, even though i pay for cable, and the show i want to watch.

like, lets say i wanted to download "Detective Conan" cause i can't stay up til 1:30 every night. i get Cartoon Network, i pay for cable, would it be "legal" for me to download it and watch it on my computer? i mean, i already kinda paid for it, right?

It starts to get a little grey at that point. But, your cable bill doesn't pay 100% for your viewing. Part of the cost of watching a show is covered by you sitting through commercials. If people stop watching commercials, distributers will start increasing the cost of cable.

I'd like to see someone start distributing over the Internet. Pay-per-view downloadable shows in xvid complete with commercials.

That's exactly what I'd want. I snag a lot of shows online b/c I've missed them or I'd like to watch them on the road. I wouldn't mind paying a reasonable fee to download them. But it begs the question: could a company make enough money on a download to continue producing the show? My initial reactions, using the Sopranos and their inflated salaries as an example, is 'no' simply b/c HBO couldn't afford to produce the show on the signficantly lesser revenue generated by a download.

I'd love to see downloads supplement a broadcast, but how much money would a network lose to people who decide to cancel their HBO subscription b/c they can download the episode the next day for a lot cheaper?

If you don't have the means to watch the show and don't pay for the service, it IS illegal. If you don't PAY for cable TV, you shouldn't be watching anything FROM cable TV.

If you paid for cable TV and missed it, that's another story.

Mike

Very true...but downloading a movie or series isn't as convienient as it seems. Not to mention the quality (or lack thereof). HBO could offer a dowbnload of the Sopranos for .99 and still make a profit IMO. They might lose on DVD sales in the long run...but I think any loss would be negligible. I would much rather own a DVD set of the Sopranos than a downloaded copy burnt to a DVD. I also don't believe an HBO series is the sole reason for a person to subscribe to a premium channel (although it could play a role in the decision making process). As a matter of fact...Starz and Encore is already offering a similar service.

Nonetheless, I agree...probably illegal. That is too bad because SG Atlantis was pretty good.

Most of the time I download shows that I would have otherwise recorded on VHS a year ago. I love the simplicity of VHS, but ever since bittorren I just like to get HDTV widescreen quality when I watch the shows.

Bad Karma: If I'm watching something that a HDTV owner can get I probably AM stealing in indirect ways. I'm not an HDTV owner so I just ripped off the HDTV makers and the HDTV set top converter people. I also just screwed over the HDTV cable and satellite people.

As far as direct karma goes, as long as you're not a Neilsen household, which means that your viewership is recorded in ratings, then I see no real threat to the commercial fees that channels/networks/TV stations get.

I also download Atlantis and that is the only show that I download that I don't get with my cable package. But I think that you can repay them by buying the DVDs or waiting for basic syndication since that's what I would have done anyway (I just couldn't wait when it came to Stargate).

It is probably illegal for the person to provide it for you to download, but it is not illegal for you to download it (except perhaps for aiding and abeting the person running the server).

Copyright is about distribution, not use. Although there are potential issues with use-licensing, broadcasting something to a region implies a use license for everyone in that region.

I worked for a cable company and this was never brought up in legality issues. Basically it is the same as getting a tape from someone.

dcolton--


Assuming it's a copyrighted work, it is illegal per 17 USC 106 to reproduce a copy of it, which necessarily occurs when you download it.

You'll need to fall within an exception, and it is unclear that any would apply here.

But just because it is illegal, that doesn't mean that it is unethical. I don't think you've done anything immoral; IMO it's roughly on par with jaywalking or building a house with too small of a setback from the property line.



If you had cable, then that would be a factor to consider, but it wouldn't be probative all by itself.

And you're not stealing; you're infringing the copyright of whoever has the copyright on the work... which is probably some production company. There's likely a copyright notice in the credits somewhere.

Whiskedjak--


That is wrong on both counts. The commercials are totally irrelevant. In fact, if commercials are included, they're separate copyrighted works that you would ALSO potentially be infringing upon.

Millennium--


Man, see, I expect better from you, Mil. That's very wrong.

Copyright is about: reproducing, distributing, making derivatives, some public performances and displays, and a number of other things as well, but those are the main ones.

Downloading copyrighted works without permission is, almost always, illegal. Exactly as illegal as distributing them, in fact. And I strongly doubt that anyone would bother with claiming that a downloader is contributorially or vicariously infringing based on the uploader's direct infringement.

You're right that use is not part of copyright, but since computers necessarily reproduce works just to display them and such (see the MAI v. Peak line of cases for this) it's impossible to use something on a computer without reproduction.

And broadcasting something likely does NOT lead to implied authorization to download. In fact, I can't think of anyone even TRYING to make that argument seriously, much less that it would have one iota of success.

So then the question would be source. If he's getting it from Bittorrent, which is where most tv rips are available from, he's probably distributing while he's downloading.

It doesn't really matter much in the ethics of it, example:

I do not have cable. I have a little wire that acts as a decent antenna. The few channels I do get happen to carry the major shows such as smallville and who's line. Now I don't pay for those shows. Thus its no different than downloading them, the only difference is the commercials and thats really only an issue if all your tv is downloaded.

That about explains it!

i downloaded a couple of episodes of Alias because abc f'ed up the scheduling a few times and had it on late or not at all. i don't think its wrong as long as your not making money on it or anything like that.

You do pay for those shows. The difference between what you get through radio and what you get through the Internet is advertising. What you are watching for "free" is really subsidised by you watching the ads. You may or may not watch them, but most people do and they pay for your "free", or heavily subsidised tv. If there weren't ads included, even tv through radio wouldn't be free. Downloads don't generally include ads.

one flaw editing out the commercials

a better idea would be to stream them and get a membership with a monthly fee like cable.

or on a sidenote you could get a card that allows cable on your computer like alchemy or eyetv and then get payperview channels.

Yea, if downloading TV rips is illegal because they lack commercials, why isn't my EyeTV illegal?