Insurance For Mac

From: jbthoo@ucdavis.edu (John Thoo)
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 93 21:20:03 PDT 
Subject: insurance for Mac equipment (report) 


Note to moderators: At the risk of repeating this submission, I'm
sending you this report for the second time.  (The notorious mailer
daemon returned my first submission.)  My apologies if this is, indeed,
reaching you for the second time. --John.
=========================================

Several digests ago, I posted the following query:
>Does anyone own any insurance for Mac equipment?  I've been thinking
>lately that perhaps I should invest in some, perhaps as part of some
>type of renter's insurance; but then something from a company called
>`Safeware' (Columbus, OH) showed up in my snailmailbox yesterday.
>
>What's your opinion?  Is insurance for Mac equipment and programs worth
>getting?  And, if so, what's the best `type' (whatever that means) of
>insurance to get?  And from where?  And how much is considered reasonable,
>and at what cost?


The response has been fabulous.  Not only were there replies posted
directly to the digest, but I also received responses directly from

  Jerry <iscjcw@uccvma.ucop.edu>
  K. A. Graff <kgraff@csd4.csd.uwm.edu>
  Harald Herchen <herchen@navier.stanford.edu>
  Ed Kaszubowski <dlogics!ejk@uu.psi.com>
  Charles Martini <cmartini@tecnet1.jcte.jcs.mil>
  Tim Richard <Timothy.Richard.Peng@um.cc.umich.edu>
  
Thanks for your help, folks.  I really appreciate your help and advice
in this matter.  Insurance can be a confusing business, especially for
one unschooled in such matters.

I am submitting a compilation of all the responses I received directly,
along with those I cut from the last few digests.  I hope that this
information will serve someone else as well as it's served me.

The upshot is that if you have renter's insurance, then you might
check into adding a rider for computer equipment.  The extent to which
such a rider would cover your equipment/software would, necessarily,
depend on your insurance company.  There are also companies around that
specialize in computer insurance, one of which is Safeware (the company
about which I enquired).  One person compared such companies to those
insurance companies that specialize in insuring motorcycle riders.  Having
one been an avid motorcycle rider, myself, I could relate to that.  Several
folks advised checking the BBB before purchasing insurance from any company
with which one is not familiar---good advice in any case.  Finally, there
was one person who reported that the BBB had nothing bad to say about
Safeware, and that Safeware's been in business since 1982.

What I've summarized above is nowhere comprehensive.
Please check out the compilation of responses I'm posting to read each of them
for yourself.  I've deleted all mailing headers from the responses I received
directly; those that I cut from the last few digests still bear their mailing
headers.

Good luck!
--John.
J. B. THOO, Math. Dept., Univ. of California, Davis <jb2@math.ucdavis.edu>


=============================================================================
MODERATORS: PLEASE CUT HERE

---------------------------------snip, snip----------------------------------

john - your regular household insurance should cover it (even if you
live in a dorm, you can buy renter's insurance in most states).  most
insurance companies require you to add a computer equipment rider on
your policy, and deductibles are usually in the $200 range (a pittance
compared to the cost of mac systems).  this shouldn't be more than
$15 to $25 bucks on top of your regualr insurance, and should cover you
for upwards of $10k.  regular renter's insurance costs around $100 a
year here in ann arbor (a college town with many many burglaries),
and also covers your stereo and cds (perhaps as great a loss as your
computer, if you have a big collection!).

-------------

John,

I had a homeowners policy last year when my Mac SE, DeskWriter, and a
whole bunch of other stuff was stolen from my house. I was advised to
get a policy with replacement value by my agent. It costs more but you
have your stuff replaced instead of getting a cash settlement based on
the depreciated value. It is a good choice if you are low income and/or
are using older equipment for your work. I had everything replaced and
was up and running again in a few weeks.

I am living in a rental unit now and have my computers covered it a renters
policy. Like the homeowners, you want to have an inventory of your stuff
and receipts, etc in a safe place.

I found out that my insurance would cover occasional use of my computer
equipment at school, but if I kept it at work (school) neither the
school's insurance or my own policy would cover it. Also if you take
computers from work home, your policy will probably not cover it and
you may get into hot water with your employer.

Good luck. Stealing computers is big business these days. We had a
$2K notebook with a $5K board for running an air pollution monitor
stolen from one of our labs during spring break last month. A big
killer in my case was that although I had my distribution disks in
a file cabinet in another room and they were not taken, I had just
set the disk file with my backups on the printer that morning. The
backups were stolen with the system, probably for the box they in.
That was probably the greatest loss for me as I had projects for work
and a lot of personal work on them. The theft of something like that
is like having a manuscript for a book stolen. You will get the medium
on which you wrote it replaced as there is no way to put a value on
your creative effort.

-------------

In comp.sys.mac.digest you write:

>Does anyone own any insurance for Mac equipment?  I've been thinking
>lately that perhaps I should invest in some, perhaps as part of some
>type of renter's insurance; but then something from a company called
>`Safeware' (Columbus, OH) showed up in my snailmailbox yesterday.

>What's your opinion?  Is insurance for Mac equipment and programs worth
>getting?  And, if so, what's the best `type' (whatever that means) of
>insurance to get?  And from where?  And how much is considered reasonable,
>and at what cost?

Why not just rely on Renter's or Homeowner's insurance?  Unless there is
some special provision, like you have special "professional uses" for
your equipment, basic home insurance should cover your mac just like
they'll cover your TV, stereo, etc.

It is my opinion that those special computer insurances are a scam.
Easy money for them.  Like selling earthquake insurance in Illinois.

Incidentally, I live in a pretty-high crime-rate area of Chicago, and I
pay $193 a year for $20,000 of coverage with a $100 deductible - basic
renter's insurance from Allstate.

Later.

-------------

Hi John,

Saw your posting in info-mac and thought I chime in with my $.02.

I've had Safeware since I bought my current Mac system (2+ years now).
Before I had an old plus, an imagewriter and a smidgeon of software. Now I
have a IIci, laser printer, CD, Syquest, monitors, and tons of software.
After discussing the insurance (or lack of it) provided by my homeowners
policy, I looked around and selected Safeware's all-risk policy. If memory
serves, I pay aboaut $200/year for $10,000 coverage. The coverage is
all-risk -- including theft, fire, power surge, damn near anything.

I (touch wood) haven't had a claim, but the company has been around quite a
while and I've *never* seen anything negative posted or written about them.

Hope this helps


ps -- most homeowners/renters policies either specifically exclude personal
computers or make you add a very expensive rider. And, many have clauses
that say if you even so much as think business while using it, your PC
becomes a business machine and you lose all coverage. I've heard, however,
that there are some homeowners/renters policies which do cover them. Check
with your agent first, and be sure you find out about all of the excusions
and deductibles.

-------------

Hi, yes, I have insurance for my Mac.  I have about $6000 worth of equipment,
and the insurance cost me $120.00.  It is a little more expensive than
other places, becuase it covers my Mac while I am on the road, i.e., in
my car, even while unattended.  I have driven over 20,000 miles, and
it is worth it.  If you just want coverage for your office, then if it
is your personal machine, you should be able to get away with $80 for
the same amount of Mac equipment.

I don't know about your place, but around here, any Mac that isn't locked
down is immediately stolen, and even if they are locked down, they
sometimes get lifted.  So insurance is essential, only one step below
backups!  I note that '486 PC's sit here blissfully unlocked, and they
have never been lifted!

I can't recall the name of my insurance agency, but they are located
in Ohio, and advertise each month in the back of MacWorld.  If nobody
else tells you, I can look it up for you.

Cheers!

-------------

Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1993 11:09:41 GMT
From: photo@theporch.raider.net (David Anderson)
Subject: insurance for Macs/peripherals/software (Q)

Info-Mac@sumex-aim.stanford.edu writes:

>Does anyone own any insurance for Mac equipment?  I've been thinking
>lately that perhaps I should invest in some, perhaps as part of some
>type of renter's insurance; but then something from a company called
>`Safeware' (Columbus, OH) showed up in my snailmailbox yesterday.
>What's your opinion?  Is insurance for Mac equipment and programs worth
>getting?  And, if so, what's the best `type' (whatever that means) of
>insurance to get?  And from where?  And how much is considered reasonable,
>and at what cost?
>Lots of questions, but I don't know where else to turn for good,
>honest advice on this.  Thanks for your help.

I have insurance on all my computer equipment, but it's wrapped up with my
business insurance policy.  It's not terribly expensive.  Outside of the
business policy, I'm not sure how I'd go about it.

David Anderson
nashville tn

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 13 Apr 93 11:14:00 CDT
From: PULLMANN@VM1.TUCC.TRINITY.EDU
Subject: Mac Insurance (R)

John Thoo asks:

>Does anyone own any insurance for Mac equipment?  I've been thinking
>lately that perhaps I should invest in some, perhaps as part of some
>type of renter's insurance; but then something from a company called
>`Safeware' (Columbus, OH) showed up in my snailmailbox yesterday.
>
>What's your opinion?  Is insurance for Mac equipment and programs worth
>getting?  And, if so, what's the best `type' (whatever that means) of
>insurance to get?  And from where?  And how much is considered reasonable,
>and at what cost?

What did this 'Safeware' outfit offer? Just as a personal opinion, I think
some sort of insurance on computers in the home is a must, but I also
think it's a field ripe for enormous rip-offs. My renter's insurance
covers my equipment if it's stolen or flooded or whatever, and I have
an Applecare policy to cover electrical/mechanical ills. This last is not
cheap, but for me it's the only way to go, because I can budget for it and
know that no matter what mega-$$$$ component of my system fails, I can
get it fixed. For someone with a larger bank account, it might make more
sense to gamble that by not paying premiums you could save enough money to
cover any problems that might come up. Then again, maybe not...
                                                               Pat

Pat Ullmann  PULLMANN@VM1.TUCC.TRINITY.EDU or PULLMANN@TRINITY (BITNET)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 93 13:59:36 PDT
From: cmartini@tecnet1.jcte.jcs.mil
Subject: [ANS] insurance for Macs/peripherals/software (Q)

John Thoo <jb2@math.ucdavis.edu> wrote for information on insurance for
Macs/peripherals/software...

I've seen the ads for Safeware, but I don't know anything else about them.
Before you buy a policy from them, I'd suggest the usual caveats:  check with
the Ohio Better Business Bureau, state insurance regulators, etc.

As to buying Mac insurance in the first place...I'm a Lieutenant in the
Navy, and I've had my computer equipment, and all electronics, insured for
years with Armed Forces Co-Op.  While that company's clientele is limited,
other insurance companies offer similar policies to what I had:  full
coverage, with a replacement-cost floater.  This covered me if, for example,
my LC & 12" monitor fell off my desk at sea and smashed to bits.  In this
instance, the company would pay for a new LC III and 13" monitor, since the
original LC and 12" monitor aren't available.  For my money, a policy without
replacement cost coverage for electronics is useless--the going rate for the
LC I bought two years ago is $800.  ACV (Actual Cash Value = depreciation)
coverage for computer equipment is no good.

Now, is any coverage needed?  Depends on your usage.  Is your Mac in a
pilferable spot (ie-your office)?  What are the chances of damage to the
equipment?  Do you have insurance for other high-value items you own?

I've never seen a policy that covers software.  The best policy I can think
of is regular backups.  If your data is especially critical, the best thing
to do is keep one recent backup off-site.  You should always keep your
master application disks locked and securely stored.

The only kind of software insurance policy I can imagine would be one that
guards you against business losses caused by loss of data/software.

Just tossin' out some thoughts...

                                       _____
                                       \   /
Chuck Martini                           \o/
Oak Harbor, WA                           |
cmartini@tecnet1.jcte.jcs.mil           _|_

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 93 13:16:19 CDT
From: gray@cmgroup.engr.wisc.edu
Subject: insurance for Macs/peripherals/software (C)

I have renters insurance through State Farm and computer equipment
(up to $8000, I believe) is included in that.  It is also replacement
insurance and doesn't shaft me on depreciation.  You can also add a
rider to the policy if you have more than $8000 of hardware/software.

I personally wouldn't be without it.  Computers and their software are
an awfully big investment to let go up in flames or get stolen
without protection.

Best regards,

Gary L. Gray                *  Engineering Mechanics & Astronautics
gray@cmgroup.engr.wisc.edu  *  University of Wisconsin-Madison

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1993 17:03:25 -0800
From: Jerry Wilcox <iscjcw@uccvma.ucop.edu>
Subject: Computer Insurance (R)

I have been most interested in seeing comments in Info-Mac regarding
computer insurance, especially the ones indicating that State Farm renter's
insurance covers computers. I have homeowner's insurance (plus earthquake,
auto, life, and a few others) also through State Farm. When I bought my
system for home several years ago, I turned first to my agent who carefully
pointed out that my policy specifically excluded "business equipment" from
any coverage. He was quite candid with me and said that while the company
would cover a Nintendo, or perhaps even something like a Commodore 64 as a
"home computer," my Macintosh System (which cost > $10K back then) was
clearly for "business" and would not be covered. He offered to write me a
"business" policy, but then was very open about telling me to look first at
the companies which specialized in insuring computers. This caused me to
stop and think about an earlier situation of a similar type -- motorcycle
insurance. Years ago when I was an active rider, I did all the research and
discovered that the "traditional" insurance companies all charged a lot
more for motorcycle insurance than did the companies specializing in
motorcycles.

Suspecting that the same thing might be true of computer insurance, I
checked with several other insurance carriers, in addition to companies
like Safeware. I learned a great deal. Some companies cover computers with
their homeowner's or renter's insurance; many do not, or make the
deductible so high that it isn't worthwhile. Some allow the addition of a
rider to cover extra value or reduce deductibile; others don't.

The bottom line for me is that I bought a policy from Safeware that covers
all of my hardware *and* software against all risks, including even power
surges and the like. One netter commented that s/he had never seen
insurance covering software, and why bother -- just keep adequate backups.
Unfortunately, a fire or earthquake might cause me to lose the
documentation and the original disks, things which a backup cannot replace.
It is a loss to me if I have to repurchase a package because I don't have
the original disks or because I need the documentation.

Your bottom line might be different, but if you think that your computer is
automatically covered by your current insurance, I'd urge you to check
again, carefully, just to make sure it actually is.

Jerry
-----
Jerry Wilcox - iscjcw@uccvma.ucop.edu   All opinions are mine alone

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1993 04:15:01 GMT
From: rik@world.std.com (Rik Ahlberg)
Subject: Mac Insurance (R)

Info-Mac@sumex-aim.stanford.edu writes:

>John Thoo asks:

>>Does anyone own any insurance for Mac equipment?  I've been thinking
>>lately that perhaps I should invest in some, perhaps as part of some
>>type of renter's insurance; but then something from a company called
>>`Safeware' (Columbus, OH) showed up in my snailmailbox yesterday.

I got the same mailing and think I'll fax them for more info... it seems
odd that they cover whatever you have without requiring a specific list of
equipment, just a price range.

But they claim they cover you for complete replacement without
depreciation... and that on my 5-year-old SE would be great if it were
ever stolen or damaged.

And it's a minor premium, only about $70 to cover up to $5,000 worth of
equipment for a year.

You might also want to look into insurance services offered by the large
users groups (BCS, BMUG, etc.) as I was just looking at a flyer on an
extension policy for homeowners insurance from the BCS.

Rik

Sources:  Safeware, 2929 N. High St., PO Box 02211, Columbus, OH 43202
          BCS Insurance Services (COMPASS Associates), 1-800-464-0703

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 15 Apr 93 14:21:08 EST
From: Kenneth Simon <KSSIMON@ucs.indiana.edu>
Subject: Safeware Computer Insurance

 In answer to the recent musings about the Safeware Insurance Company:
I just bought some insurance from them after checking with the
Better Business Bureau: they are a member of the BBB with no complaints
on file.  They have been in business since 1982.

Sounds promising to me!

 ------------
Kenneth Simon, Indiana University
Internet: KSSIMON@INDIANA.EDU   Bitnet: KSSIMON@IUBACS

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1993 08:46:25 -0600
From: bwalls@marvin.msfc.nasa.gov
Subject: Computer insurance (C)

Jerry Wilcox says
>...system for home several years ago, I turned first to my agent who
carefully
>pointed out that my policy specifically excluded "business equipment" from
>any coverage. He was quite candid with me and said that while the company
>would cover a Nintendo, or perhaps even something like a Commodore 64 as a
>"home computer," my Macintosh System (which cost > $10K back then) was
>clearly for "business" and would not be covered. He offered to write me a
>"business" policy, but then was very open about telling me to look first at
>the companies which specialized in insuring computers.

Just wanted to comment that I have State Farm Homeowner's insurance. They
cover computer equipment up to about $3000, and offer a rider for more
expensive things. This is the same type policy as for furs, guns, and coin
collections. Home computers (and other consumer electronics) are much more
common today than a few years ago, so calling any real computer "for
business" may have changed, but I woul…

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