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Apple Floppy Drive Cardboard Insert for 128k Computer?
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Apple Floppy Drive Cardboard Insert for 128k Computer?
Apple Floppy Drive Cardboard Insert for 128k Computer?
Peripherals 43 posts
Jan 12, 2009 — Aug 23, 2010
Did the 128K actually ship with a cardboard insert for the 400K floppy drive? If so, this is the first I've heard of it (which is not saying much).
I know the 800K drives had a head parking problem and required the yellow plastic insert for transportation, but I didn't think this was a problem for the 400Ks as it was not for the 1.44MB drives.
I know the 800K drives had a head parking problem and required the yellow plastic insert for transportation, but I didn't think this was a problem for the 400Ks as it was not for the 1.44MB drives.
That is an interesting artifact (although I myself would never pay the price offered). I owned a Mac 128k when it was brand new in 1984. But I was only 13 then and the unpacking process went rather swiftly. I recall a few things about that day, such as learning how to use the mouse. But I cannot for the life of me remember if the internal drive had that insert or not. Sadly, I don't have the original packaging for that machine to verify. But if was used on the Macintosh to protect the drive head, I don't see why it also would not have been used on the Macintosh XL. Even so, I was not able to Google up anything enlightening. I guess we just need to find a photo of a brand new Mac 128k or XL being unpackaged. (Sadly, most people didn't do that in those days!)
IIRC a lot of Apple products with floppy drives used a yellow piece of plastic in the shape of a floppy disk. Never heard of that one before though.
Now that Mac Plus fake cardboard disk is nifty!
So Apple began using those just before the yellow plastic inserts then? Curious what the 512ke used in its 800k drive.
So Apple began using those just before the yellow plastic inserts then? Curious what the 512ke used in its 800k drive.
Hmmmm. Was that floppy "pamphlet" actually shipped in the drive? So the drive ejects it when powered on? If it's a pamphlet I assume once opened it would cause problems if reinserted into the drive? I can certainly understand Apple shipping a pamphlet about the drive since it was revolutionary in the Mac world, both introducing HFS and double-sided disks, not to mention incompatibilities with existing Macintosh 400K disks. Love to get a look at the contents.Now that Mac Plus fake cardboard disk is nifty! So Apple began using those just before the yellow plastic inserts then? Curious what the 512ke used in its 800k drive.
Here's my problem: the 800K UniDisk drive came out in September '85. Since the 800K drives had this head parking problem, the drives had to be shipped with a dummy disk. Whether they discovered this before or after they began shipping the UniDisk drive is unknown, but it would have required an insert eventually. EDIT: The UniDisk manual says to remove the packing disk and discard, suggesting it may have been cardboard.[/E] I always assumed it was the yellow plastic one, for the main reason that I have an original beige 800K External Drive for the Mac in the original packaging and it came with the yellow disk. Since this drive was sold only between January 86 and September 86, when the Apple 3.5" Drive was released, did it always ship with the yellow disk or did it begin with the cardboard disk? So, at what point did APple switch to the yellow disk with all products?
Again, I was not aware the 400K drives ever shipped with a disk insert, since the heads of a 400K disk did not have this problem.
And while we are on the subject, I would like to pose one further question...
Who sold 1-sided cleaning floppies in the era of 400k floppy drives? Most of you know that 2-sided cleaning disks cannot be used as they would shred that poor felt pressure pad inside the 400k drive. I've read about these single-sided cleaning disks in old documentation, but I don't recall who sold them. I've never seen one pop up on EBAY either. Sure would be nice to have one of those as I loath cracking open the case to manually clean the head (which is the only realistic way of doing the cleaning job without a cleaning floppy).
Who sold 1-sided cleaning floppies in the era of 400k floppy drives? Most of you know that 2-sided cleaning disks cannot be used as they would shred that poor felt pressure pad inside the 400k drive. I've read about these single-sided cleaning disks in old documentation, but I don't recall who sold them. I've never seen one pop up on EBAY either. Sure would be nice to have one of those as I loath cracking open the case to manually clean the head (which is the only realistic way of doing the cleaning job without a cleaning floppy).
The Australian Mac Pluses - at least the later ones came with the yellow transport sheets (affectionately known at the time as "the piece of cheese"). I only recall them shipping with 800k drives.
I can't find it now, but I'm almost certain there was a technical advisory after the 1.4MB drives started becoming popular advising against putting the yellow disks in them. Apparently it could, under some circumstances damage the 1.4MB mechanism and some users were sticking the 800k transport sheets into their 1.4MB drives - even though the machine hadn't shipped with anything like that originally.
I can't find it now, but I'm almost certain there was a technical advisory after the 1.4MB drives started becoming popular advising against putting the yellow disks in them. Apparently it could, under some circumstances damage the 1.4MB mechanism and some users were sticking the 800k transport sheets into their 1.4MB drives - even though the machine hadn't shipped with anything like that originally.
I'm pretty sure the cardboard insert shown in that sale was never part of the 128K or any early Macintosh packaging. I certainly don't remember anything like it.
I guess there's a long-shot chance that the Sony drives that shipped to Apple for use inside the Macintosh came with these (i.e., Apple removed them during the manufacturing process), but I'd rate that highly unlikely. I've always thought the yellow plastic inserts were produced by Sony and came from Japan (IIRC, they don't have Apple part numbers).
So the cardboard insert probably belongs to something else. The good-quality Japanese typography would seem to indicate a Japanese origin. My guess is that this has nothing to do with Apple and the seller has made a faulty assumption based on it being part of a cache of early Apple stuff he or she bought. It may have come with a third-party external drive.
I guess there's a long-shot chance that the Sony drives that shipped to Apple for use inside the Macintosh came with these (i.e., Apple removed them during the manufacturing process), but I'd rate that highly unlikely. I've always thought the yellow plastic inserts were produced by Sony and came from Japan (IIRC, they don't have Apple part numbers).
So the cardboard insert probably belongs to something else. The good-quality Japanese typography would seem to indicate a Japanese origin. My guess is that this has nothing to do with Apple and the seller has made a faulty assumption based on it being part of a cache of early Apple stuff he or she bought. It may have come with a third-party external drive.
I have no idea if the cardboard floppy came in the drive - I would have thought not as the cardboard could foul the mechanism too easily. I know the yellow plastic fake disk did - I think I have one in the shed...
shred & macgreg speak of damage to the floppy drive in cases where the yellow "cheese" is used. I would like to know the "technical" reason for such damage. For indeed, if the heads could be damaged, why then did Apple ship so many of those plastic inserts?!
As to whether or not a cardboard floppy came with the Mac 128k, perhaps one of the brave among us could ask the seller what evidence he has to prove it did come with the 128k? I am very curious, but I doubt this particular seller would appreciate a query from me. :I
(I'm also still very curious about single-sided cleaning disks!)
As to whether or not a cardboard floppy came with the Mac 128k, perhaps one of the brave among us could ask the seller what evidence he has to prove it did come with the 128k? I am very curious, but I doubt this particular seller would appreciate a query from me. :I
(I'm also still very curious about single-sided cleaning disks!)
An interesting codicil to the Item linked above is that, as of this moment (13:55 Tue 13 Jan 2009 GMT) the relevant selling page discloses the curt
'This item has ended.'
without any comment as to a sale or a withdrawal.
de
Correction. Further down the page is the statement: 'The seller ended this listing early because the item is no longer available for sale.'
'This item has ended.'
without any comment as to a sale or a withdrawal.
de
Correction. Further down the page is the statement: 'The seller ended this listing early because the item is no longer available for sale.'
Quite interesting indeed, Equil. Someone on EBAY is clearning reading this thread, it would seem. 8-o
Well, I don't feel it came with the 128k Mac. I say this because the photo shows Japanese text on the insert. Apple didn't seriously begin addressing the Japanese market until KanjiTalk came on the scene, long after the 128k. I am more inclined to believe this was the manufacturer's insert for a floppy drive, with the manufacturer being a Japanese company.
Well, I don't feel it came with the 128k Mac. I say this because the photo shows Japanese text on the insert. Apple didn't seriously begin addressing the Japanese market until KanjiTalk came on the scene, long after the 128k. I am more inclined to believe this was the manufacturer's insert for a floppy drive, with the manufacturer being a Japanese company.
Also, I'm not even sure that cardboard insert, with that strip that sticks out the back of it, would even fit into a Sony OA-D34V-series single-sided drive (i.e., the drive used in the 128K and 512K).
Been a while since I opened one of these up, and I'm too lazy to do it now, but I don't remember a place for that strip to go...
Been a while since I opened one of these up, and I'm too lazy to do it now, but I don't remember a place for that strip to go...
My yeller-feller, piece o' cheese or whatever claims, on the reverse or hub side, MADE IN JAPAN and 5 in separate incuse mouldings. '5' may be a mould identification or a revision number.
On the obverse or label side is moulded relief text in Japanese, English and French. Apart from the quaint English syntax ('Insert this sheet under transportation.'), there is no statement of purpose, maker or (Apple or other) model or part number.
My memory, dimly through the mists of time, is that the 'sheet' came to me in a superdrive FDD with one-or-other Compact AIO, so long after production of all Compact AIOs had ceased as to be entirely unindicative of anything but its presence.
de
On the obverse or label side is moulded relief text in Japanese, English and French. Apart from the quaint English syntax ('Insert this sheet under transportation.'), there is no statement of purpose, maker or (Apple or other) model or part number.
My memory, dimly through the mists of time, is that the 'sheet' came to me in a superdrive FDD with one-or-other Compact AIO, so long after production of all Compact AIOs had ceased as to be entirely unindicative of anything but its presence.
de
Apple Plus manual where you can find out that Plus cardboard is just a flyer
http://www.shrani.si/f/41/aE/4t5wfHnA/p1010132.jpg
800K Drive manual saying about protective yellow disk (©1985)
http://www.shrani.si/f/2S/6B/1uyiXIB/p1010134.jpg
http://www.shrani.si/f/S/LV/3RTkWVdN/p1010135.jpg
http://www.shrani.si/f/41/aE/4t5wfHnA/p1010132.jpg
800K Drive manual saying about protective yellow disk (©1985)
http://www.shrani.si/f/2S/6B/1uyiXIB/p1010134.jpg
http://www.shrani.si/f/S/LV/3RTkWVdN/p1010135.jpg
Hmmm. I assume you use the double-sided variety without penalty in your 800K & SuperDrives? Obviously you are correct concerning the 400K drive issues, but I have always been trained to only manually clean my tape heads with an alcohol solution and lint free applicator. The rationale being that the commercial cleaners can easily damage the heads. I have applied this logic to VHS, cassette and floppy drive heads (though the latter is more because I never cleaned a drive head until I began repairing my vintage Macs, I certainly did not do this in practical application when the Macs were new). Many friends warned me NOT to use the floppy disk cleaner kits popularly sold in the late 80s and 90s by such vendors as Memorex in particular. I suspect much of the problems which arose was from using them without properly lubricating the cleaning surfaces or in cheap or defective drives in which the heads were already poorly mounted or aligned, but still, this was the prevailing wisdom I grew up with. Urban legend, or substance?Most of you know that 2-sided cleaning disks cannot be used as they would shred that poor felt pressure pad inside the 400k drive. I've read about these single-sided cleaning disks in old documentation, but I don't recall who sold them. I've never seen one pop up on EBAY either. Sure would be nice to have one of those as I loath cracking open the case to manually clean the head (which is the only realistic way of doing the cleaning job without a cleaning floppy).
As to the 400K drive cleaner, I wonder if you could open up a double-sided cleaner and mount the cleaning surface onto a standard disk and reassemble. That way, a smooth surface would glide over the pad, while a cleaning surface would scrub the head. The disk would only be slightly thicker and likely negligible in terms of operation.
As for robert2d3d's retraction of the item which inspired this thread, I will not speculate further to prevent any hint of libel. ;-)
That would work: 5.25" disk cleaning kits employed a disk with a pop-out on the lower side, so that they would work with single or double head drives. You can make your own, as long as it doesn't foul the drive mechanism.As to the 400K drive cleaner, I wonder if you could open up a double-sided cleaner and mount the cleaning surface onto a standard disk and reassemble. That way, a smooth surface would glide over the pad, while a cleaning surface would scrub the head. The disk would only be slightly thicker and likely negligible in terms of operation.
Is there any mention of a disk drive preserver on the 128K packing list -- from memory, I think not. Single head drives don't need a lot of protection, because the head can only bounce off a felt pad.
The description of 3.5" drive packing materials for shipping is in the service manual copy that I sent you a few months ago, Mac128 ;-)
Have you actually seen a packing list? Did one come with your fine example?Is there any mention of a disk drive preserver on the 128K packing list -- from memory, I think not.
Oh, I really must get scanning.The description of 3.5" drive packing materials for shipping is in the service manual copy that I sent you a few months ago, Mac128 ;-)
UPDATE:
The Dec 88 service manual indicates a "packing disk" for transporting an 800K drive. The 400K drive notes indicates nothing of the kind. Therefore, I'm inclined to think there was not one, though this is not conclusive since the manual is not specific on a number of details regarding the 400K drive in preference to the 800K drive.
No, Mac128, I have never knowingly seen a packing list (anywhere outside my box, too) -- and I have just been delving in the Picasso box for one. I believe that I am only missing the MacWorld promotional flier.
But Eric Rasmussen commented here recently...
But Eric Rasmussen commented here recently...
I've never seen a "packing list" either -- I believe the photo and list in the Getting Started pamphlet was meant to serve that purpose.
One note on that list -- it exposes one of the problematic details on my site. The list shows just one blank disk with the sticker attached. I believe that by May 1984 (i.e., in the Finder 1.1 boxes) they were packing two blank disks with labels unattached -- that's my memory from late Summer or early Fall 1984 when I bought my first computer (a 128K Macintosh in Bozeman, Montana) and I've seen enough corroborating evidence to confirm that. BUT, the early, January-April, boxes might well have had only one blank disk, with or without its label attached...
So on the site I contradict the pamphlet and say two blank disks were included. But that could be wrong for early packages, or not -- obviously the photo and the list were put together well before any actual boxes were packed. It's not hard to imagine them putting two blank disks in from the beginning -- providing only one is kind of lame.
One note on that list -- it exposes one of the problematic details on my site. The list shows just one blank disk with the sticker attached. I believe that by May 1984 (i.e., in the Finder 1.1 boxes) they were packing two blank disks with labels unattached -- that's my memory from late Summer or early Fall 1984 when I bought my first computer (a 128K Macintosh in Bozeman, Montana) and I've seen enough corroborating evidence to confirm that. BUT, the early, January-April, boxes might well have had only one blank disk, with or without its label attached...
So on the site I contradict the pamphlet and say two blank disks were included. But that could be wrong for early packages, or not -- obviously the photo and the list were put together well before any actual boxes were packed. It's not hard to imagine them putting two blank disks in from the beginning -- providing only one is kind of lame.
Then again, selling the 128K with a single disk drive is kind of lame too. :beige:It's not hard to imagine them putting two blank disks in from the beginning -- providing only one is kind of lame.
I recently spotted this Mac 128k auction, listed by the original owner. What captured my interest was the yellow plastic drive insert which we are discussing in this thread. I wrote the seller and asked about its origins. I told him that his external drive appears to be an 800k model, which implies his ROMs may have been upgraded at some point. I then asked if the yellow insert was found inside his internal 400k drive in 1984 or in the external. He replied to me today as follows:
DISCLAIMER: My intentions toward this seller are 100% neutral. I am mentioning this auction merely to discuss the origins of Macintosh floppy drive inserts, which is the topic of this "innocent" and non-libelous thread.
Alas, he cannot remember. Therefore, it is highly likely the insert was used in that external drive. But it's impossible to know for sure.Hi James,I wish I could tell you about the drive insert, but this stuff has been covered and stored for over 20yrs and I just don't remember it's origin. Regarding the ROMs: There was a local engineer and member of the Portland Mac User's Group that made some extra money upgrading ROMs and RAM. I recall that he may have upgraded the ROM while upgrading the RAM.
Thanks for your interest.
DISCLAIMER: My intentions toward this seller are 100% neutral. I am mentioning this auction merely to discuss the origins of Macintosh floppy drive inserts, which is the topic of this "innocent" and non-libelous thread.
I get the feeling they started using the yellow disk at one of the following points in time:
1. When the black label Sony drives were introduced in place of the red label drives (800K drives had two label colors)
2. When the Apple 3.5" external drive was introduced alongside the Apple IIGS (since it was a different design)
3. When the SE, II, and platinum Plus and 512Ke came out in March 1987
1. When the black label Sony drives were introduced in place of the red label drives (800K drives had two label colors)
2. When the Apple 3.5" external drive was introduced alongside the Apple IIGS (since it was a different design)
3. When the SE, II, and platinum Plus and 512Ke came out in March 1987
The damage I referred to only occurred if the yellow transport sheet was used in a drive that it was never designed for: the 1.4MB drive. I've never heard of it damaging the 800k drives it was designed to go in to.shred & macgreg speak of damage to the floppy drive in cases where the yellow "cheese" is used.
shred, I appreciate your reply. But why would the yellow disk not damage an 800k drive but damage a 1.4MB Superdrive? Is the head placement that much different between the two drive types? Regardless, 800k floppies are exactly the same shape as 1.4MB floppies! Or is it that 1.4MB heads are more delicate and easily damaged due to scratches induced by the yellow plastic inserts?
There were two different drives. The UniDisk which came out in sept. '85 indicates to remove the shipping insert and discard. If it were the yellow disk, one would expect instructions to retain for future use. However, the 800k external drive, a different mechanism, which came out in early '86, did have the yellow disk. This means that the Sept. 86 3.5 drive, the same mech as the UniDisk, shipped with the yellow insert. So clearly the insert started shipping at some point between Sept. 85 and Sept. 86. Did the Mac Plus ship with the insert from the beginning? If not I would think it began shipping with one at the same time the 800k external drive did.I get the feeling they started using the yellow disk at one of the following points in time:
You raise a good point and I don't know why it was unsuitable for the 1.4MB drives.shredBut why would the yellow disk not damage an 800k drive but damage a 1.4MB Superdrive?
I always assumed that it was damage to the head gimbal due to the heads catching on the transport sheet as it was inserted or removed, but this was only an educated guess.
This Mac 128k auction has a photo that shows the yellow plastic insert sitting inside the Mac, apparently being used in the stock 400k drive. Of course, this is by no means "evidence" of the yellow disk having been used in 1984. If fact, I cannot imagine the yellow insert could have been used then. Because if you take a look at one, isn't there a curved section for the head on both sides? Why make such a thing in 1984 (or actually, in 1983) before 800k double sided drives even existed?