Thread
New 9" SVGA monochrome monitors $70 [eBay]
"New Factory Sealed 15-pin Super VGA 9" Monochrome VM-9AF Monitor"
Long eBay link. Not my auction, etc...
I put this in H&D instead of Trading Post because these little monitors are really only interesting if you're hacking a (already really dead) compact Mac to:
The seller says he has 50 of them.
I'll follow up once I get it.
Long eBay link. Not my auction, etc...
I put this in H&D instead of Trading Post because these little monitors are really only interesting if you're hacking a (already really dead) compact Mac to:
- be an external monitor
- house a Mac mini or little PC
- make RaspberryPi emuMac
- or something similar
The seller says he has 50 of them.
I'll follow up once I get it.
If you don't mind opening the thing up, would you let us know if there's a part number on the CRT. It would be interesting to find out if it's using one of the CRTs that is compatible with compact Macs.
I found a trove (5) of new 9" CRTs some years ago which were replacement parts for 9" B&W Panasonic Security Monitors. The part number on the CRT was identical to the HRmumble number for the compact Macs and they included a driver board with many components identical to a compact Mac's analog board.
Anyway, it would be especially interesting if the CRT in these was a brand new replacment for the CRT in Compact Macs. Especially good for those units with burn in and such.
I found a trove (5) of new 9" CRTs some years ago which were replacement parts for 9" B&W Panasonic Security Monitors. The part number on the CRT was identical to the HRmumble number for the compact Macs and they included a driver board with many components identical to a compact Mac's analog board.
Anyway, it would be especially interesting if the CRT in these was a brand new replacment for the CRT in Compact Macs. Especially good for those units with burn in and such.
I will be taking it apart immediately upon receiving it 
I'm using it for a hack that was detailed in a nice long thread here but, after the picture purge of '14, that thread is now completely useless.
I'll (perhaps ironically) post pictures in this thread when it arrives.
I'm using it for a hack that was detailed in a nice long thread here but, after the picture purge of '14, that thread is now completely useless.
I'll (perhaps ironically) post pictures in this thread when it arrives.
with a little crazy taxi?
I just ran across this auction yesterday, matter of fact. all because I had CRT on the mind and started looking at amber/green CRTs.
Even if the CRT is a different part number, as long as the bolt pattern and curvature is the same, it doesnt matter.
the pinout will be almost certainly the same, and the neck diameter as well, so it will accept the original deflection yoke of the Plus, SE, etc... And if its a 9" CRT, the voltages should all be about the same as well.
I just ran across this auction yesterday, matter of fact. all because I had CRT on the mind and started looking at amber/green CRTs.
Even if the CRT is a different part number, as long as the bolt pattern and curvature is the same, it doesnt matter.
the pinout will be almost certainly the same, and the neck diameter as well, so it will accept the original deflection yoke of the Plus, SE, etc... And if its a 9" CRT, the voltages should all be about the same as well.
The SVGA "monochrome" 9-inch monitor I have was grayscale, by virtue of sending all three color signals to one pin on its little AB. And its curvature fit the Classic II bezel curve-for-curve bolt-for-bolt; perfect. I never took the yoke off, but someone (probably techknight) assured me the pins would match up. Now that I'll have a replacement maybe I'll check the neck-pins and possibly swap it with the burnt-in one in my latest SE/30
I don't think CRTs lose brightness if they're just sitting around, do they? Or do little gas molecules sneak into the tube and oxidize the phospors or some such? Contaminate the cathode?
I agree that NOS is what should be expected. I have trouble imagining that anyone would still be manufacturing CRTs, but these could be the tail end of a run for a niche market.
I agree that NOS is what should be expected. I have trouble imagining that anyone would still be manufacturing CRTs, but these could be the tail end of a run for a niche market.
My local recyclers won't even sell CRTs any more, because for a few years now Missouri makes them charge $12-$15 per tube to recycle them (which totally doesn't make people leave them on random corners instead of easily and responsibly recycling them... : ). Once they've charged somebody to recycle one they are obligated to actually recycle it and may not re-sell it. The minimum wage dudes from the county work-release across the street who work the dock don't make decisions; they just charge you $15 for anything with a tube. I've seen really nice CRT iMacs, eMacs, and AIOs all totally unavailable because they'd already been paid to be recycled.
). Once they've charged somebody to recycle one they are obligated to actually recycle it and may not re-sell it. The minimum wage dudes from the county work-release across the street who work the dock don't make decisions; they just charge you $15 for anything with a tube. I've seen really nice CRT iMacs, eMacs, and AIOs all totally unavailable because they'd already been paid to be recycled.They dont lose brightness "persay" But... the older the CRT is/longer it sits dormant, there ARE impurities in the CRT and it will oxidize the cathode material in the electron gun.
This will cut-off/weaken emissions from the gun until the oxidized material gets burned off.
This is called "waking up" the tube after a long slumber. (many decades).
usually you have to run up the filament voltage to around 8V for a few minutes to a half hour to get emissions back up into the green again.
Got it today. Haven't had time to decase it yet, but it is certainly very similar to a stock Mac compact tube from the front.
Nice sharp bright little monitor. It looks good at 800x600@60, better at 640x480@60, best at 640x480@59. The stock video on the dell 760 I was testing it with had the option of 848x480@60. Looked pretty nice at that. As good as 640x489@60. Don't think a Mac will output that res tho.
It will not do 1024x768@60, nor any of the above at the other frequencies offered by the vid card I was using (72, 73, 75). It looked great at 32 bit color, the same at 16 bit, and the way Windows 7 acts at 256 colors made it look like crap.
Nice sharp bright little monitor. It looks good at 800x600@60, better at 640x480@60, best at 640x480@59. The stock video on the dell 760 I was testing it with had the option of 848x480@60. Looked pretty nice at that. As good as 640x489@60. Don't think a Mac will output that res tho.
It will not do 1024x768@60, nor any of the above at the other frequencies offered by the vid card I was using (72, 73, 75). It looked great at 32 bit color, the same at 16 bit, and the way Windows 7 acts at 256 colors made it look like crap.
Pics.
The monitor looked great in person at 640x480@59Hz, but my camera made it dim.
Looked great at 800x600@60Hz too.
When I took the case off this was the tube inside:
I haven't checked the tube's pins to see if they match a compact Mac's. I hate to mess with yokes; everything seems so fragile and pointy and shocky in there.
It looked like it would bolt right into a tubeless Classic body I had handy...
So I popped it in there!
It fits perfectly. No gaps in the bezel or anything.
I hooked it up to an LC475 at 800x600@56Hz and it looks very nice.
I need to fiddle with the contrast and brightness a bit, but those knobs were on the front, so it'll take some screw-driving to tune it now.
All-in-all a fairly easy and successful procedure
The monitor looked great in person at 640x480@59Hz, but my camera made it dim.
Looked great at 800x600@60Hz too.
When I took the case off this was the tube inside:
I haven't checked the tube's pins to see if they match a compact Mac's. I hate to mess with yokes; everything seems so fragile and pointy and shocky in there.
It looked like it would bolt right into a tubeless Classic body I had handy...
So I popped it in there!
It fits perfectly. No gaps in the bezel or anything.
I hooked it up to an LC475 at 800x600@56Hz and it looks very nice.
I need to fiddle with the contrast and brightness a bit, but those knobs were on the front, so it'll take some screw-driving to tune it now.
All-in-all a fairly easy and successful procedure
There were video cards with adaptors to output more than 1-bit to compact internal screens.
There isn't much difference between thousands and millions of colors output-ed to these grayscale monitors, but 256 colors is noticeably less smooth in gradients and photos than either higher setting.
There isn't much difference between thousands and millions of colors output-ed to these grayscale monitors, but 256 colors is noticeably less smooth in gradients and photos than either higher setting.
In that case it's bog standard 60 Hz VGA. AFAIK, you'll only get that out of the Quadra 630 and up off built-in video. NuBus Card time, can't think of a PDS card that will output 60Hz at any res offhand.
I'd check the LCD/Mac Compatibility thread for details on what's already been tried with what results.
Short Bed TAKKY Hack gone Quadra 630 + (external )Analog Conversion Box = Digital B&W TV for your SmoochyMacHack too! Video Connector I/O Board is perfect for internalizing your connection, there's plenty of cubic and that clears the backplane DA-15 punchout for your stalled KVM setup as well.
p.s. I know somebody who has everything but a spare Classic Chassis to mod the @$$ end and a spare RoadApple PPC to use as packing to ship a certain Video Cable your way as well. He owes you big time. :I
800x600@56Hz and 640x480@59Hz are probably juuuuuust close enough to 640x480/800x600 VGA/SVGA @ 60Hz to barely hold sync. It sounds like you need to fiddle with the baseline settings to make those work "right" with slightly out of spec signals. It's almost certainly not a multisync capable Monitor. techknight will have to chime in again, I'm just guessing that higher than 60Hz will be impossible for it to hold sync.
848x480@60Hz is 480p, so I'm really surprised it works, isn't that a bastardization of the 800x600@60Hz SVGA standard?
beans, Al!Still works like a champ. The main difference I observe between its tube and a vintage Mac tube is the tube itself is a lighter gray than a stock Mac. This could contribute to the bluer look mentioned above. Sitting next to a stock Mac Classic, neither powered-up, you can pick out the new tube as the lighter of the two. Powered on they are harder to differentiate.
Has anyone gotten this monitor to sync at 1024x768? When I try 1024x768 @ 60 Hz from my Raspberry Pi B+ (w/Gert's VGA666) it looks like it’s displaying alright, just not synced horizontally (the full range of the H-sync adjustment doesn’t quite get it there). Would a different potentiometer (greater possible resistance) help? (Sorry if that’s a ridiculous question; I’m fairly ignorant on analog CRT electronics!)
Earlier someone said it wouldn't do 1024x768@60. Just a guess, but if the monitor *says* it supports "1024x768" I sort of wonder if it only does it at the old interlaced "8514" scan rate, which of course isn't very useful these days.
"SVGA" is technically only 800x600. If they are literally SVGA monitors then 800x600 is the highest res they are designed for.
1024x768 is "XGA." Seems like they would advertise themselves as such if they were capable.
My (not at all comprehensive) testing couldn't get it to display more than 800x600@60 (or 848x480@60), but I didn't try XGA resolution at lower frequencies than 60. I'm curious to see if I can try the Apple 832x624 res at a lower freq. My testing window is closing fast. School starts next Tuesday.
1024x768 is "XGA." Seems like they would advertise themselves as such if they were capable.
My (not at all comprehensive) testing couldn't get it to display more than 800x600@60 (or 848x480@60), but I didn't try XGA resolution at lower frequencies than 60. I'm curious to see if I can try the Apple 832x624 res at a lower freq. My testing window is closing fast. School starts next Tuesday.
There's "XGA" the resolution, and there's "XGA" in the actual IBM XGA card and the matching monitor; originally XGA used the same 1024x768@43hz interlaced as 8514... which, again, is something that's hardly used anymore because 43hz interlaced was deemed massively headache inducing. (The IBM XGA adapter was *rapidly* superseded by an XGA-2 that supported non-interlaced modes.) The total bandwidth (dot clock/vsync) of a 800x600x60hz SVGA monitor are about the same as 8514/A so it's very possible the monitor here supports it. Not that it's useful or anything, though.
I bought one of these on eBay, but my Mac 128k I picked up cheap ($50 plus shipping) works too well to swap this into. So I'll save the 9" monitor for another project, I'll end up with a dead compact Mac sometime....
As to 1024x768, the manual shows that it only supports the 8514 interlaced mode. So 800x600x60hz seems to be the best option.
These do look like they were made for point of sale systems. Mine has an attached male power cord, to plug directly into the power supply of the host computer.
As to 1024x768, the manual shows that it only supports the 8514 interlaced mode. So 800x600x60hz seems to be the best option.
These do look like they were made for point of sale systems. Mine has an attached male power cord, to plug directly into the power supply of the host computer.